Re: [IAC#RG] Italian Marines a corruption issue

Dear Sarbajit,

I did not quite understand this 'Lastly, the Indian SC has been behaving in a strange way for quite some time now.'
I think, at least, in this matter SC has taken laudable stand.

Manmohan

On Sat, Mar 16, 2013 at 2:35 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Mr. Thakur

"Bharat" is not (yet) a State of Italy.

I am not focusing on the drama taking place in India. The Italians in Jan 2013 had threatened that they would be taking the matter to International Court of Justice. Like in the Bhpoal gas tragedy, a deal was worked out (ie huge bribes have been paid) to get the marines off. All the paper work (like SC undertaking etc) were put in place to delay and confuse matters. It must be remembered that Mr.jHarish Salve comes from an old Congress family of proven loyal to the family.

The Italian marines are not going to return to face trial (unless we force them to return). The recent criminal laws amendments and mood of the Indian nation is worrying them.

Italian Govt has publicly stated that they are now INTERNATIONALLY DISPUTING the return of the marines. If they had tried this with the United States there would have been a fleet of Aircraft carriers raining bombs by now, with or without a declaration of war.

India can do nothing because of the following reasons.

1) No UN Security Council seat and no ally there.
2) We have neglected Russia and allow/ed China to become their biggest client for arms.

All India can do is bluff and bluster. If we have so many nuclear bombs and missiles, now is the time to use a few of them.like North Korea does. Our good friend France will have to choose between Italy or us.. Our new missiles can just about reach Italy with a reduced payload.

Lastly, the Indian SC has been behaving in a strange way for quite some time now. It is useless to expect that anything will emerge - from them unless we FORCE THEM TO ACT.

Sarbajit

On Sun, Mar 17, 2013 at 12:38 AM, <devinder.thakur@btopenworld.com> wrote:

Mr Roy.

 

With all due respect, it would be wrong to call the present crisis between the State of Bharat and Italy as a state of war. The Italian government has reneged on a sovereign undertaking given by none other than their Ambassador in India. which the SC accepted in good faith. The failure of the ambassador to produce the two Italian marines as promised would mean that the said ambassador would be, personally,  in breach of his solemn undertaking and therefore an act of contempt of court. The august court has already issued orders for the Ambassador not to leave India. and that is where the matter rests at the present time. We should wait for the next step that the SC takes in the matter.

The idea of a state of war with Italy is nothing more than a jingoistic nonsense.at the present time. Can you imagine India being in a state of war with a country which is a NATO.ally? 

Although no doubt, in the event of war, the foreign aliens do become suspects, I can not see how on earth can we declare India born Rahul and Priyanka Gandhi as foreign aliens and Mrs Gandhi by virtue of being the mother of two India born children as well as an MP under Oath of Allegiance without any clear ground(s).  Reg. Devinder.

 

 

 

 

From: Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com>
To: indiaresists <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>

Sent: Saturday, 16 March 2013, 17:59
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] Italian Marines a corruption issue

Sir

1) If the Govt of Italy does not return its marines on 22.03.2013 and treats it as a bilateral dispute then we are in a state of war, whether formally declared or not.

2)  For a person to be treated as an enemy alien, it is not needed for war to be formally declared. Even persons with acquired citizenship are treated as enemy aliens (for eg. the WW-II Japanese Americans in 1942) . India also has a long history of this, in the 1962 war Indian citizens of Chinese origin were treated as enemy aliens and interned. In  our wars with Pakistan, Muslims were always viewed with great suspicion (rightly or wrongly is not the issue).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enemy_alien

3) If Italy fails to return the marines, then Ms. Sonia Gandhi's NAC Chairperson position, as an Italian born naturalised Indian who has never publicly clarified if she has formally given up her Italian citizenship / passport, will become quite untenable.

4) IAC has specific information that the marines were going to do the bunk in December itself. But the above mentioned points came in the way. Hence the marines were reluctantly returned to India,  Rahul Gandhi was hastily made #2 in the Congress party, some blood money provision was made in the SC to keep the foolish Indian public quiet, and the marines were allowed to slip away again.  Sonia herself will slip away for "medical treatment" very soon (and the NAC will be disbanded). At least that is the present plan obtained from IAC''s reliable sources.

Sarbajit

On Sat, Mar 16, 2013 at 10:49 PM, <devinder.thakur@btopenworld.com> wrote:

With regard to Item G, whatever be the outcome of the case with the Italian government. It would be foolish to suggest that Mrs Gandhi and her family be treated as the enemies of India as they have no direct or indirect involvement in the case. Moreover, as citizens of India they have all the rights and protection in law as any other Indian.subject, .notwithstanding the Italian origin of Mrs S Gandhi and the IAC should bear this in mind. Devinder .  

From: Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com>
To: indiaresists <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Sent: Saturday, 16 March 2013, 16:03
Subject: [IAC#RG] Italian Marines a corruption issue

Dear IAC members

After reading the 100's of emails (especially the unpublished ones) on the subject issue when linked with Smt. Sonia Gandhi's possible dual nationality it is abundantly clear that the consolidated views of the members are as follows:-

A) That IAC should treat the issue in a national way instead of as political issue to score brownie points

B) That it is a matter of grave national concern if the Italian marines were allowed to leave the country with the full knowledge of the Chief Justice of India knowing that they were unlikely to return, and for which a security was taken.

C) That this is another scandal, like the Bhopal Gas settlement, if the Supreme Court, has again facilitated foreign murderers getting away after heavy bribes are paid to the Congress party (and/or its "dual citizenship" President) to allow them to escape. The "blood money" is no substitute for justice.

D) That this sordid episode reeks of JUDICIAL CORRUPTION and it is nothing but a corruption issue considering that the offenders were in India's judicial custody (albeit enjoying extraordinary privileges and 5 star comfort) and the tables have been turned on the Congress led State Government of Kerala which arrested the marines in the first place and had their notional custody. The Chief Justice of India Mr. Altamas Kabir should immediately resign.

E) That the members want IAC to coordinate with all other like minded forces on this issue.

F) That on Sonia Gandhi's dual nationality question IAC should proceed cautiously to ensure that IAC does not end up with egg on its face in case Mrs. Gandhi has actually renounced her Italian citizenship. However, if she has not done so then it is equally a corruption issue which needs to be vigorously pursued.

G) That if no resolution emerges on the Marines issue by 22 March 2013, then irrespective of the subsequent orders of the Court, India should consider itself at being in a state of war with Italy and that naturalised Indians of Italian origin like Ms. Sonia Gandhi and her family be deemed as enemy aliens and treated as such.

H) That Mr. Harish Salve's integrity and honesty is directly in question if he tendered the guarantees on behalf of his client.

Since the views of the members have been aggregated as above, if anyone wishes them to be modified/amended before they are formally adopted please post short and crisp responses/objections/suggestions to this list and we will try and publish as many as possible, otherwise the above points shall be deemed as adopted.

Sarbajit

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