Saturday, November 30, 2013

Re: [IAC#RG] A lost opportunity owing to lack of wisdom / statesmanship

Till today no one has asked Sheela Dixit that why no Politician /Officials responsible for plying of illegal buses in Delhi has been punished . 
Delhi Government
Chief Minister 
Transport Minister
Transport Commissioner  
Central Government
Home Minister
Police Commissioner

They were the real culprit for that incident . That Bus was moving uninterrupted on
 the road for hours together watched by policemen standing on the road.

Brig JAGJIT SINGH AHUJA
 


On Sat, Nov 30, 2013 at 10:03 PM, tadepalli triambakakishore <ltcolttkishore@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Veteran Col Shivraj for your response.
Allow me to preempt a feeling  I might have inadvertently created of , " being supportive of Nizams' reign" . The stress is sought to be on perpetuating a composite culture and accommodative politics of a multi faceted society. Further nature abhors exclusivity( the beautiful fauna and flora seen in Nature though beings of same ' feather' flock together others also share the space).
Hope we will be spared from the self seeking onslaught of evil nexus of bad Babus/ politicians/ corporate and social criminals.
May be some ,' Avatar' conforming to,' Sambhavami yugey  yugey'  delivers the Aam aadmi.
Veteran TTK


On Saturday, November 30, 2013, Col Shivraj wrote:
Dear Friends,
I entirely & fully agree with Col TT Kishore.
The Politicians supported by the media and bureaucrats have divided us at the drop of the hat. They will use any method to divide us like caste / creed / colour, North / South / East / West, educated / uneducated, urban / rural, men / women, advocates / rest, teachers / rest, haves / have nots. rich / poor, terms like middle class etc.
In Delhi elections, all these terms are used to divide the voters, like Poorvanchalies, Punjabies,Teachers , Advocates, middle class etc depending upon the areas,

We must look into the larger perspective and think of India as a whole.
With modern technologies, when egovernance can produce better results, it will be wrong to further divide the states.

For Delhi citizens, it is a very crucial election. Every voter must come out to vote. They must see the larger picture to form a stable Govt.

regards

Col Shivraj


On Sat, Nov 30, 2013 at 10:19 AM, tadepalli triambakakishore <ltcolttkishore@gmail.com> wrote:


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: tadepalli triambakakishore
Date: Saturday, November 30, 2013
Subject: A lost opportunity owing to lack of wisdom / statesmanship
To: "letters@thehindu.co.in" <letters@thehindu.co.in>


Way back in 50 s a Hyderabad State was very much in existence and Nizams reign had  a harmonious spectrum of Brahmins(Malayalam/Tamilians/Telugus/ Maharashtrians) Kayasthas,Merchant Princes( Marawaris/ Gujarathis/Kutchies/P unjabis/S indhis / indigenous Vysyas) , Reddis, Gouds( Anjiah Goud of Paradise talkies fame),Velamas,Rajput descendants ( claiming presence from Kakatiyas'  period), various artisans ( goldsmiths/ stapathis/carpenters/ metal smiths) including 
weavers ( Padmashalis)/Tailors/potters and indigenous folk artistes( having flavours of Kannada/ Marathi/ Telugu/ Deccani) and of course theNizam' s Royal  courtiers ( of Arabic / Turkish / Iranian roots / local Moslems) and not forgetting the colorful Anglo Indians& Parsis & Sikhs amongst myriad others . 
The demography was akin to the later idea of unity in diversity  and Hyderabad was a perfect representative of what India ie Bharat ought to be. BUT  thanks to the selfish / egoistic/feudal / elitist mentality of Political Leaders of that time  a composite multicultural entity like Hyderabad State was parceled off to form finally present Linguistic States.( it is said that Telugu speaking areas of Hyderabad State were attached to the Telugu speaking Coastal Andhra and RayalaSeema to neutralize the prevailing Brahmin dominated Political Class by Reddis who were culturally rich and had feudal clout and were keen to join forces with Telangana Reddis).
Instead of crying over spilt milk can we the common people strive to regain our sanity and stop the self seeking politicians who cynically are indulging in electoral politics.
One solution could be to establish the erstwhile Hyderabad State and put it under Presidents Rule till people ie Politicians learn to accommodate all regions ' aspirations.
Veteran( LtCol) TTKishore


--
LTCOL(retd) T T KISHORE
FLAT NO-134, SECTOR-A,
AWHO COLONY, SIKH ROAD,
GAUTAM ENCLAVE,
SECUNDERABAD-09
Res-040-27840415
Cell-9912594602



--
LTCOL(retd) T T KISHORE
FLAT NO-134, SECTOR-A,
AWHO COLONY, SIKH ROAD,
GAUTAM ENCLAVE,
SECUNDERABAD-09
Res-040-27840415
Cell-9912594602

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--
Col Shivraj
210 Munirka Vihar
New Delhi-110067
Phone: 26102999
Mob: 9810433842
http://www.google.com/profiles/colshivraj.
http://www.facebook.com/poster.hatao
MY DELHI , POSTER and NOISE FREE DELHI



--
LTCOL(retd) T T KISHORE
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AWHO COLONY, SIKH ROAD,
GAUTAM ENCLAVE,
SECUNDERABAD-09
Res-040-27840415
Cell-9912594602

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Re:[IAC#RG]

Some other forum for acrimonios(and endless) language debate pl. Sanctity and purposefulness of IAC not be violated brazenly. Let anti-corrution movewment succeed in every nook and corner and in every language/vernacular. Wasteful internal cribbing is the surest way to defeat IAC movement. Moderator could pl ensure that waywardness doesn't become the law. SPM
Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

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Subject: Re:[IAC#RG]

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[IAC#RG] Fw: [media_monitor5] Re: JanLokPal Bill follies


----- Forwarded Message -----
From: "devinder.thakur@btopenworld.com" <devinder.thakur@btopenworld.com>
To: "media_monitor5@yahoogroups.com" <media_monitor5@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, 1 December 2013, 3:08
Subject: Re: [media_monitor5] Re: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies
In reply to the response from our learned friend. all one has to do is to agree with him. There is no doubt that it is a matter of few months now that  not only all the cases against Baba Ram Dev Ji, will be dropped, but if any magistrate tries to go ahead, may find himself subject to certain "snoopgate" activities.
 
The question is where is the probity in public life. Baba Ram Dev Ji seems to have this innate tendency of land grab, other people's land. The last BJP government in Himachal Pradesh allotted a certain trust land to Baba JI on a 99 years lease at a princely ground rent of Rs.1 per annum. Baba JI went ahead and built some unauthorised structure on the land. This land belonged to Maharajah of Patiala who gave it to a trust to build a girl's school in Himachal Pradesh. His son Capt Amrinder Singh wrote to the present Govt. who on coming to power, cancelled Baba Ji's lease and sent for the demolition of the unauthorised structure. Baba Ji went to the Himachal Pradesh high court against the demolition orders against a "breach of natural justice". There is no doubt that Baba Ji will have to remove the structure as the original covenant under which the land was given has been breached by the last BJP Govt.. .
 
    

From: Hindu Voice <hinduvoicemumbai@yahoo.co.in>
To: "media_monitor5@yahoogroups.com" <media_monitor5@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, 30 November 2013, 16:19
Subject: Re: [media_monitor5] Re: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies
 
Any one who drives vicarious pleasure at the detention of Baba Ramdev at the Heathrow Airport or at the false cases being foisted on him is an anti-national. This pleasure will last for a maximum of say 6 months. Then he will have to cry for his sins. P. Deivamuthu
Editor, Hindu Voice
On Saturday, 30 November 2013 4:18 PM, "devinder.thakur@btopenworld.com" <devinder.thakur@btopenworld.com> wrote:
 
To drop everything and help another proud "son of the soil"  the great champion of "Kala Dhan" His Holiness Baba Ram Dev Ji Maharaj, as they have slapped another six cases of illegal Govt. land grab and evasion of stamp duty etc, against his trust, making them 87 altogether. The cases are registered in the Hardwar Magistrate's court.
 
It looks that there is no end in sight to the woes of Baba JI,.starting with the detention at the Heathrow Airport of some eight hours.   Devinder

From: vasant sardesai <vasant_sardesai@yahoo.co.in>
To: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net" <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Cc: Kumar Arun <kumar2786@hotmail.com>; Bharat Swabhiman Trust <missionbharatswabhiman@gmail.com>; Mukund Apte <mdapte@gmail.com>; Subramanian Swamy <swamy39@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, 29 November 2013, 15:51
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies
What actions do you expect from the members of this furum?
 
V.S.Sardesai

From: L. B. Thapa <apasmalb@gmail.com>
To: vasant sardesai <vasant_sardesai@yahoo.co.in>
Cc: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net" <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>; Kumar Arun <kumar2786@hotmail.com>; Bharat Swabhiman Trust <missionbharatswabhiman@gmail.com>; Mukund Apte <mdapte@gmail.com>; Subramanian Swamy <swamy39@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, 29 November 2013 3:00 PM
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies
It is difficult to believe to the members of No Action Talking Only (NATO).
It is always better to ACT on time like medicine should be provided before patient dies in respect to pass the Jan Lok Pal Bill! We observed the fasting to death of Annaji as well on the same issues but???? 

On the mid night of June 4, 2011 Ram Lila converted into Rawan Lila who cared till date?

Many people counted their chicken before they are hatched.
 
I agree to one of gentlemen's posting below that one needs to consider the following three elements :

Practicality! Legality !! and Necessity !!! prior to pass any Bills in the Parliament.

Hatts off to my colleagues if you ACT than to talking only since last forty years!!! 

L B
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:00 PM, vasant sardesai <vasant_sardesai@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
You are right; Janlokpak Bill was drafted on the basis of Lokpal Bill which was then pending with the Parliament for more than forty years to fool and divert the attention of the people from the Baba Ramdevji's movement of bringing back the moneys deposited in the foreign banks.
 
V.S.Sardesai 
From: Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com>
To: indiaresists <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Sent: Friday, 29 November 2013 10:55 AM
Subject: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies
Dear Mr. Mathur

I have appended your submissions in 2011 on Lokpal Bill to RS Standing Committee below your email message.

The central thrust from every anti-corruption expert is that any effective Ombudsman (LokPal) should be reserved for high-level corruption only (ie. PM down to Joint Sec, and Higher judiciary only).

It is the corrupt forces who misled innocent Indians into taking to the streets in 2011 for a worthless and impractical legislation known as "Jan Lokpal Bill"

PS: Shri Mathur (IPS 1972)  is a retd. DGP  of Tamil Nadu Cadre awarded President's Police Medal for meritorious service 2002.

Sarbajit

On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 9:25 AM, <santmathur@gmail.com> wrote:
Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone -----Original Message-----
From: santmathur@gmail.com Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 03:10:08 To: Girender Singh<girinder_singh@yahoo.com> Reply-To: santmathur@gmail.com Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] Update: PUBLIC NOTICE: To IAC's old volunteers now disillusioned with AAP
Irrespective of the coinage of the term "India Against Corruption" (you can even have World Against Corruption,or Cosmos Against Corruption, for that matter to fool lot of people some of the time at least), the waywardness of the "Strategy"/ Holistic or Integrated approach" betrayed the agenda of the organisers of (what can at best be called as) rabble rousing. It shocked the.conscience of tens of thousands of "anti-corruption professionals" and finest brains/scholars involved for decades in practising/improving the anti-corruption work that sheer street smartedness was trying to hijack the agenda and too through an extremely shoddy and totally poorly conceptualised idea like "LP" or JLP" Bill. Nothing was more anti-democratic than imposing (as a motley group of five) themselves on the nation a sole saviours or conscience-keepers of the nation. Is that the idea of a "participative democracy" or serving personal agenda through "mobocracy"? Will Lokayukta Bill" not be drafted through participative democratic process,which surely is a time-consuming process,when done in a cool-headed manner? What a part of the "absolutely reasoned/seasoned strategy" could be has been shared with many and Sh S Roy is going to place it for the knowledge of the members of this forum too . Yes, pl go through my comments sent to the Standing Committee and be enlightened as to what Statute - formation exercise should be and how.   people will feel cheated and indignant for having been taken for a ride. No one sticks one's neck out on knowing what the perfectionist professional /legal mechanism is in anti-corruption crusade,and that how this has already for long been demanded in appropriate fora, without taking to the streets through a deviant donation-collection system. I would,as a professional/researcher in anti-corruption arena (for decades) request the masses not to let themselves down and be wisened on going through my articulation on LPB. Not the best way to sermonise ad infinitum on the holistic anti-corruption strategy/management/operation. Wait,pl wait.this too, will be done in public domain shortly.S P Mathur IPS DGP(retd) BE MBA PhD Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone
                                                         
Dr. Abhishek Manu Singhviji
Chairman
Standing Committee on AR & PG
Rajya Sabha
New Delhi
 
Sir,
 
Sub: Lokpal Bill 2011-Suggestion and comments-regarding
 
As the time available to register suggestions and comments is not sufficient, I am unable to present an alternative draft of my own, nor am I able to offer very comprehensive comments at this juncture, but could do so positively, if given an opportunity to present myself before the Committee headed by you.
 
The limited areas on which I would like to offer my comments are given as below:
 
GENERAL: Any Statute has to pass through the acid that  of:
·        Necessity
·        Legality
·        Practicality
 
It has then to be subjected to next line of sieve consisting of techno management tools comprising  of :
 SWOT  analysis , and
 
DATT (The Bono's 10 famous principles of creative decision making -Direct Attention Thinking Tools) & Deming's theory of Profound Knowledge.
 
At next stage come the concepts of scientific decision-making process,  using decision-tree and pay-off matrix/matrices.
This work is assisted – or has to be assisted necessarily – by regression/multiple regression analysis so that decision-making is truly evidence-based and could pass the due diligence muster, mandated by SC. 
                                                     
Nothing can - and should - be done in haste just because historically delay in decision-making has taken place. Two wrongs DON''T A RIGHT MAKE. No dilatory tactics also could be applied or 'paralysis by analysis' (Unwarranted nit picking) for extraneous considerations, resorted to.
 
Your great wisdom, at individual and collective level, could set a fine balance. This Valuable suggestion is made to avoid recourse to extreme positions as advocated by many people/groups.
 
SPECIFIC
 
(i) Selection of Lokpal (Chairman/Members)
Must be fair and merit-based as also transparent and seen to be so. Screening committees and Selection Committee should have 50% non-officials (eminent & relevant personnel) who are conversant with the process of HR assessment.
 
(ii) Coverage
·                    Lokpal must cover the PM (in serving capacity also) for legal, practical & psychological reasons. With PMO adopting RFD (Result Framework Documentation) and becoming increasingly transparent, there is no valid reason to fear that vexatious and frivolous complaints would harm the power and position/performance of the PM.
 
Safeguards are, of course, possible like agreement by half or two thirds of Lokpal Members agreeing to take up Enquiry/Investigation. Certain sensitive areas like 'international relations', 'nuclear programmes/test', 'national security' etc could be kept out of the purview of Lokpal.
 
If the PM is not included, all the Ministries, directly under the charge of the PM, will get excluded from the purview of Lokpal and that would be an anti-thesis of the spirit of Lokpal legislation. Arguments against the common law of equality are devoid of merit, and any evidence and apprehensions are purely misplaced. Previous Standing Committees have agreed to the inclusion of The PM under Lokpal coverage, and nothing has changed since then.
 
This one single provision would act as master stoke to create pervasive deterrence. Not only this, the PMO, acting proactively, wouldn't allow any    
 Minister or high profile functionary to act in corrupt/dishonest manner.
 
The nation is not vertically divided over this issue. Just a microscopic minority, for unresearched and unimaginative reasons, has been taking a contrarian view.
 
·                    Judiciary could be covered under Judicial Accountability Bill. This is now generally agreed to. An important import of their concept is that Lokpal institution doesn't have to - and just can't-provide omnibus coverage to all types of personnel/agencies/ organisations.
 
·                    While the conduct of MPs, within the Parliament (under Art 105)  could be kept out of the purview of Lokpal there is absolutely no justification in keeping their conduct outside parliament out of Lokpal purview, specifically in view of SC judgment, declaring MPs as public servants. The parliamentarians should rise above 'party line' and 'privileged' position and support the move to look like commoners in the eyes of law and common people. It's essential also to redeem the practically low esteem in which they are held by the masses at large, their exalted positions and unaccounted privileges notwithstanding. They, as public representatives, must set an example (of leadership) of probity in public life, rather than find cover behind fig leaf of technicalities, or assailable like of arguments.
 
·                    The lower bureaucracy (below JS level) must be kept out of the purview of Lokpal. The statistics of CVC/CBI indicate that there has never been any problem in handling their cases specially as they don't enjoy  great clout/power and have very little discretion to indulge in corrupt practices at mega level.
 
Lokpal is a premier institution. There is no need to use a sledge hammer to kill a fly. Lokpal institution has been conceptualized as part of 'gap analysis' to cover high profile /powerful functionaries over which traditionally CBI/CVC hasn't been able to provide requisite cover. CVC's Annual Reports speak volume on this subject.
 
Thousands or lakhs of cases could clog the functionaries of premier institution like Lokpal. Also the modern management principles talk in terms of decentralisation of administrative work and about lean organisations.
 
The current concept of vigilance at unit/departmental level and enquiry/investigation at CBI/CVC level could be – rather must be – improved through greater autonomy/empowerment & thoughts check-list based system, as also through point-of-action proportionate accountability system.
 
·                    The best way to kill Lokpal, in infancy, is to have lower judiciary under Lokpal, directly or indirectly. Once corruption at high places get  nipped in the bud, cascading effect, ripple effect, and deterrence in varied form  would automatically prevent harassment/corruption at lower level.
·                    For the same reasons as given for lower bureaucracy; all other types of personnel/agencies (NGOs, Associations etc) must be kept out of purview of Lokpal.
Its not one-stop shop for combatting deviant behavior on part of different types of personnel/ organisations. Like Judicial Accountability Bill taking care of judiciary, other Statutes need to be created to handle malfunctioning of media/NGOs/Associations etc.  The Lokpal, as the very objective of the Bill says, is to handle corruption at high places.  It's an open and shut case for exclusion of stray types of personnel/agencies for coverage under Lokpal.
 
(iii) Functions:
'Less to do more' must be the motto for premier institution like Lokpal. Quality work and not the quantity must be the Organisation's functional philosophy. Check-list based enquiries and investigation in time-bound manner could produce desired result. One doesn't shoot 100 rounds to shoe away 100 pigeon's perched on the tree-top. Media management, for deterrence does the trick even in just a few cases, possibly in one single case.
 
Lokpal shouldn't handle administrative work of disciplinary action like employee's dismissal etc; as ab-initio itself it's contrary to legal/constitutional provisions. People using PIL with information obtained through RTI could always question if the State/ Departments give scant/ inadequate attention to Lokpal's recommendations. With an independent investigative wing under its control, enjoying the powers of police station and, clothed with all legal provisions it could handle searches, seizures and arrests etc, of course in cautious manner.These personnel, from different departments/organisations could initially be taken on deputation , and later, if necessary ,be absorbed also. Direct recruitment,at some stage, could also be thought of purposefully. That would be the only way to maintain requisite independence of the investigation wing, something  seen to be missing from the current system of functioning of CBI/ED/IT etc.
 
For work-in-progress etc, on receipt of complaints, Lokpal, on enquiry, could seek reports and make recommendations for avoidance of irregularities /malpractices and corrupt practices.
 
Wherever administrative powers are available with existing Authorities the same should not be tinkered with, for if the righteous (looking) recommendations of Lokpal are ignored or rejected (even indirectly through delay) people could seek remedy through PIL, getting requisite information under RTI. There must be no question of overreach for Lokpal for it to look like a monstrous institution.
 
Lokpal's functions must be in sync with its basic objectives.
 
(iv) Lokayukta:
If under RTI Act, 2005 & Electricity Act, 2003, State level Institutions could be conceived & set up, why likewise under the central legislstion (Lokpal Bill 2011) provision for Lokayukta at state level can't be there? Under Art 252,just if 2 States  agree, State Lokayukta's could be set up there and other States could follow-up  the model or could eventually even be covered under  the same Act. Existing Lokayukta's could get subsumed under the new provision like CVC was when CVC Act 2003 came into being.  State Lokayuktas on the model of Lokpal need to cover high level functionaries only to provide punch and quality work. The existing state vigilance and anti-corruption mechanism could - and should-be strengthened to take care of lower level functionaries. A bench-marked service delivery mechanism, through a separate State level legislation should take care of petty level corruption. It would take care of the day-to-day issues of harassment / hassle/corruption/delay with which the common people are concerned with.
 
(v) Citizen's Charter
However important this subject might look,it has simply nothing to do with Lokpal as this issue needs to be dealt with through wholly different mechanism/institutions/statutes.
 
Just by making mention of citizen's charter in Lokpal Bill no purpose will be served. This issue requires separate serious consideration & consultation,some what beyond the levels provided for currently by the Department of personnel and public grievences. A comprehensive note on this issue will be shared separately.
 
S.P.MATHUR
IPS DGP (Retd)
BE MBA PhD
03.09.2011

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Posted by at No comments:

Re:[IAC#RG]

Have used Hindi ,while posted in Delhi,and
Communicating to Rly.Board to
Torture R.B
Would ,use Hindi to fillip medical reports,of UPSC candidates of 3 member medical boards.
Each member had to fill his,or,her,form completely,then signed by all 3.
Mutravishlashan for urine analysis
Varan bodh me dosh for defective color vision 
And so on
Rly Board wrote back that all 3 forms should be identical.
Letter intercepted by Hindi zealots in transit,that one Hindi zone writing to another Hindi zone,CAN write in Hindi ,to stop which will raise the hackles of Parliaments Hindi Committee.

That was over 35 years ago,when ,Hindi was not so,
Prachalit.j.K.Chaudhry
Unifying factor has to be enthusiastically evolved,
Not imposed.


Sent from my iPad

On Nov 30, 2013, at 11:36 AM, jp Char <char.jp@gmail.com> wrote:

Maaf kijiye. As far as I know, Hindi is not Rashtra Bhasha (National Language) , but  raj bhasha (official language) only, which means that the central govt shall correspond with only hindi states in Hindi. The southern states have the liberty to correspond in english.

Dr J.P. Char


On 12 November 2013 10:52, Rajendra Thacker <rjthacker57@gmail.com> wrote:
Priya Bandhuo, ( Dear Friends ),

We must  respect all languages. Hindi is National language of Bharat and we should be proud of it. If one do not know Hindi is not a reason to feel ashamed. Our Nation has borrowed British system. Therefore we have to learn English for communication. NO NEED TO FEEL ASHAMED FOR NOT KNOWING HINDI. BUT ONE MUST SEE THAT NEXT GENERATION SHOULD LEARN HINDI. 

No Nation can develop without it own language. Every Nation must have Bhav, Bhasha and Bhumi - means - Love for Nation, Own language and Own land. Then only we can have a complete Nation. We all are Bhartiya and we should not waste our time on the issues that you people have taken up.

Devote your time to create awareness among citizens about their rights under the Constitution. We have long way to go. Be constructive and devote time to do little bit what one can do for the betterment of the Nation.

Rajendra J Thacker
92233 27838 


On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 11:11 PM, kalyanam sundaresan <ask_maadhyama@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
My Dear Chhabil Aggarwal,

Thank you for your response.  You said that I should be ashamed for not knowing Hindi.  OK.  You said Hindi is a National Language.  Who declared Hindi as a National Language? A handul of Hindi Parliamentarians hailing from North India enjoying all comforts(luxurious life at the cost of TGax Payers Money)  at Delhi declared Hindi as a National Language. My humble request to you is to kindly visit down Vindhyas places like Bangalolre, Chennai, Cochin, Trivandrum, or East of India like Kolkatta without a Guide to explain you in Hindi.  After visiting these places without a Hindi translating Guide, please tell me your experience.  Then we will decide who is ashamed. 

You may be a Native of UP or Haryana.  Even in North India, you please visit rural villages in Assam, Manipur, Nagaland, Bihar, West Bengal, Odissa, Gujarath, Maharastra, and speak to them in Hindi.  Please tell me your experience whether they understand Hindi and speak to you in Hindi.  

My humble request to you is to understand the reality in the country and if you still feel that I should feel ashamed for not knowing Hindi, I am taking it on my strides.I had interacted with so many Hindi Speaking People and learned few Hindi words but, I cannot make a good sentence.  Non-Hindi speaking people who go to North for jobs, military service, business pick up Hindi and they become very proficient in Hindi.  So, the opportunities, circumatances and environment make a person to learn other languages.  Thus, so many Non-Hindi speaking people learned Hindi.      
 
With Best Regards,
A.S.KALYANAM


On Tuesday, 5 November 2013 7:24 PM, CHHABIL AGGARWAL <chhabil_aggarwal@hotmail.com> wrote:
Dear Kalyanam,

I think you should feel ashamed if you don't know hindi. Hindi is a national language since 1965 and till now you could not able to accept this fact then how can you claim that a new language will be accepted.

So please don't show double standards and request you to accept this fact that hindi is a national language of india.


Regards
Chhabil 
Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

-----Original Message-----
From: kalyanam sundaresan <ask_maadhyama@yahoo.co.in>
Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2013 14:33:41
To: <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Subject: Re:[IAC#RG]






Dear All,


The Message is in Hindi.  The Sender should know that still there are atleast 50% of Indians  cann't read and write Hindi.  Some Indians whose Mother tounge is not Hindi, may speak Hindi but cannot read and write.  

After Independence, lot of efforts had been made to Hindi as a Official lanugauge.  But, there are lot of objections from so many quarters, not only from Tamil Nadu and even from other States of India.  Like Constitution of India, which is borrowed from various Constitutions, it is high time, all the major Indian Languages like, Hindi, Bihari, Kashmiri, Gujarathi, Marathi, Odisa, Telegu, Kannada, Tamil, Malayalam, Bengali, Assamee,Panjabi, Samskrit  (Urdu also you include, even though, it is not an Indian language)  Konkini, Tulu, (There may be more more Indian languages, but there are the major speaking languages) Pick up (borrow) the Alphabets from each language and and script a new Indian common language.  Appoint a Committee of Expert in the various Indian Languages and entrust them to formulte a entirely a new language a combination of all Indian languages so that it will be acceptable to all Indians so that there will be a common language which should be introduced in all Schools at Pre KG itself.   so that at one point of time, may be after another 50 years, there will be a common language through out India.  


Once, we have a Common language in India, there will be little  partisan feelings,(all the linquistic bountaries will go) which will help a lot for India's development.  Even though, India spends lot of money for developments, it is not reaching the common man.  The Nature has gifted so many natural resources for man's existence like Rivers, Mountain, Forest, Lands, Minerals.  Even though, we claim to be more forward thinking,(unorthodox)  dynamic, we are not properly  utilising the Natures Bounty..  Other countries elsewhere in the world, are fully utilising the Nature's Bounty.  But, we are mailes aware from the developments comparing the other countries in the world, basically because of Linguist barrier which mar all developmental activities. 

INDIA LACKS A GOOD LEADERSHIP EVENTHOUGH, THERE ARE GOOD NUMBER OF EDUCATIONIST, PROFESSIONALS, ENTREPRENUERS, PATRIOTIC.  THERE ARE VERY GOOD RIGHT THINKING LEADERS.  ENLIGHTENEND CITIZENS SHOULD IDENTIFY THEM AND BRING THEM TO THE FORE, AND HANDOVER THE MANTLE FOR INDIA'S DEVELOPMENT.









 
With Best Regards,
A.S.KALYANAM





  On Monday, 4 November 2013 8:04 AM, Shanti Bhushan <shantibhush@gmail.com> wrote:
 
Excellent work.please continue doing this good work for the people of India.

Sent from my iPad

On Nov 3, 2013, at 12:39 PM, Ghulam kundanam <ghulam.kundanam@gmail.com <> > wrote:

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Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC#RG] A lost opportunity owing to lack of wisdom / statesmanship

Thanks Veteran Col Shivraj for your response.
Allow me to preempt a feeling  I might have inadvertently created of , " being supportive of Nizams' reign" . The stress is sought to be on perpetuating a composite culture and accommodative politics of a multi faceted society. Further nature abhors exclusivity( the beautiful fauna and flora seen in Nature though beings of same ' feather' flock together others also share the space).
Hope we will be spared from the self seeking onslaught of evil nexus of bad Babus/ politicians/ corporate and social criminals.
May be some ,' Avatar' conforming to,' Sambhavami yugey  yugey'  delivers the Aam aadmi.
Veteran TTK

On Saturday, November 30, 2013, Col Shivraj wrote:
Dear Friends,
I entirely & fully agree with Col TT Kishore.
The Politicians supported by the media and bureaucrats have divided us at the drop of the hat. They will use any method to divide us like caste / creed / colour, North / South / East / West, educated / uneducated, urban / rural, men / women, advocates / rest, teachers / rest, haves / have nots. rich / poor, terms like middle class etc.
In Delhi elections, all these terms are used to divide the voters, like Poorvanchalies, Punjabies,Teachers , Advocates, middle class etc depending upon the areas,

We must look into the larger perspective and think of India as a whole.
With modern technologies, when egovernance can produce better results, it will be wrong to further divide the states.

For Delhi citizens, it is a very crucial election. Every voter must come out to vote. They must see the larger picture to form a stable Govt.

regards

Col Shivraj


On Sat, Nov 30, 2013 at 10:19 AM, tadepalli triambakakishore <ltcolttkishore@gmail.com> wrote:


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: tadepalli triambakakishore
Date: Saturday, November 30, 2013
Subject: A lost opportunity owing to lack of wisdom / statesmanship
To: "letters@thehindu.co.in" <letters@thehindu.co.in>


Way back in 50 s a Hyderabad State was very much in existence and Nizams reign had  a harmonious spectrum of Brahmins(Malayalam/Tamilians/Telugus/ Maharashtrians) Kayasthas,Merchant Princes( Marawaris/ Gujarathis/Kutchies/P unjabis/S indhis / indigenous Vysyas) , Reddis, Gouds( Anjiah Goud of Paradise talkies fame),Velamas,Rajput descendants ( claiming presence from Kakatiyas'  period), various artisans ( goldsmiths/ stapathis/carpenters/ metal smiths) including 
weavers ( Padmashalis)/Tailors/potters and indigenous folk artistes( having flavours of Kannada/ Marathi/ Telugu/ Deccani) and of course theNizam' s Royal  courtiers ( of Arabic / Turkish / Iranian roots / local Moslems) and not forgetting the colorful Anglo Indians& Parsis & Sikhs amongst myriad others . 
The demography was akin to the later idea of unity in diversity  and Hyderabad was a perfect representative of what India ie Bharat ought to be. BUT  thanks to the selfish / egoistic/feudal / elitist mentality of Political Leaders of that time  a composite multicultural entity like Hyderabad State was parceled off to form finally present Linguistic States.( it is said that Telugu speaking areas of Hyderabad State were attached to the Telugu speaking Coastal Andhra and RayalaSeema to neutralize the prevailing Brahmin dominated Political Class by Reddis who were culturally rich and had feudal clout and were keen to join forces with Telangana Reddis).
Instead of crying over spilt milk can we the common people strive to regain our sanity and stop the self seeking politicians who cynically are indulging in electoral politics.
One solution could be to establish the erstwhile Hyderabad State and put it under Presidents Rule till people ie Politicians learn to accommodate all regions ' aspirations.
Veteran( LtCol) TTKishore


--
LTCOL(retd) T T KISHORE
FLAT NO-134, SECTOR-A,
AWHO COLONY, SIKH ROAD,
GAUTAM ENCLAVE,
SECUNDERABAD-09
Res-040-27840415
Cell-9912594602



--
LTCOL(retd) T T KISHORE
FLAT NO-134, SECTOR-A,
AWHO COLONY, SIKH ROAD,
GAUTAM ENCLAVE,
SECUNDERABAD-09
Res-040-27840415
Cell-9912594602

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Col Shivraj
210 Munirka Vihar
New Delhi-110067
Phone: 26102999
Mob: 9810433842
http://www.google.com/profiles/colshivraj.
http://www.facebook.com/poster.hatao
MY DELHI , POSTER and NOISE FREE DELHI



--
LTCOL(retd) T T KISHORE
FLAT NO-134, SECTOR-A,
AWHO COLONY, SIKH ROAD,
GAUTAM ENCLAVE,
SECUNDERABAD-09
Res-040-27840415
Cell-9912594602
Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies

To drop everything and help another proud "son of the soil"  the great champion of "Kala Dhan" His Holiness Baba Ram Dev Ji Maharaj, as they have slapped another six cases of illegal Govt. land grab and evasion of stamp duty etc, against his trust, making them 87 altogether. The cases are registered in the Hardwar Magistrate's court.
 
It looks that there is no end in sight to the woes of Baba JI,.starting with the detention at the Heathrow Airport of some eight hours.   Devinder

From: vasant sardesai <vasant_sardesai@yahoo.co.in>
To: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net" <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Cc: Kumar Arun <kumar2786@hotmail.com>; Bharat Swabhiman Trust <missionbharatswabhiman@gmail.com>; Mukund Apte <mdapte@gmail.com>; Subramanian Swamy <swamy39@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, 29 November 2013, 15:51
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies

What actions do you expect from the members of this furum?
 
V.S.Sardesai

From: L. B. Thapa <apasmalb@gmail.com>
To: vasant sardesai <vasant_sardesai@yahoo.co.in>
Cc: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net" <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>; Kumar Arun <kumar2786@hotmail.com>; Bharat Swabhiman Trust <missionbharatswabhiman@gmail.com>; Mukund Apte <mdapte@gmail.com>; Subramanian Swamy <swamy39@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, 29 November 2013 3:00 PM
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies

It is difficult to believe to the members of No Action Talking Only (NATO).

It is always better to ACT on time like medicine should be provided before patient dies in respect to pass the Jan Lok Pal Bill! We observed the fasting to death of Annaji as well on the same issues but???? 

On the mid night of June 4, 2011 Ram Lila converted into Rawan Lila who cared till date?

Many people counted their chicken before they are hatched.
 
I agree to one of gentlemen's posting below that one needs to consider the following three elements :

Practicality! Legality !! and Necessity !!! prior to pass any Bills in the Parliament.

Hatts off to my colleagues if you ACT than to talking only since last forty years!!! 

L B

On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:00 PM, vasant sardesai <vasant_sardesai@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
You are right; Janlokpak Bill was drafted on the basis of Lokpal Bill which was then pending with the Parliament for more than forty years to fool and divert the attention of the people from the Baba Ramdevji's movement of bringing back the moneys deposited in the foreign banks.
 
V.S.Sardesai 
From: Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com>
To: indiaresists <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Sent: Friday, 29 November 2013 10:55 AM
Subject: [IAC#RG] JanLokPal Bill follies

Dear Mr. Mathur

I have appended your submissions in 2011 on Lokpal Bill to RS Standing Committee below your email message.

The central thrust from every anti-corruption expert is that any effective Ombudsman (LokPal) should be reserved for high-level corruption only (ie. PM down to Joint Sec, and Higher judiciary only).

It is the corrupt forces who misled innocent Indians into taking to the streets in 2011 for a worthless and impractical legislation known as "Jan Lokpal Bill"

PS: Shri Mathur (IPS 1972)  is a retd. DGP  of Tamil Nadu Cadre awarded President's Police Medal for meritorious service 2002.

Sarbajit

On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 9:25 AM, <santmathur@gmail.com> wrote:

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

-----Original Message-----
From: santmathur@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 03:10:08
To: Girender Singh<girinder_singh@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: santmathur@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] Update: PUBLIC NOTICE: To IAC's old volunteers now disillusioned with AAP

Irrespective of the coinage of the term "India Against Corruption" (you can even have World Against Corruption,or Cosmos Against Corruption, for that matter to fool lot of people some of the time at least), the waywardness of the "Strategy"/ Holistic or Integrated approach" betrayed the agenda of the organisers of (what can at best be called as) rabble rousing.

It shocked the.conscience of tens of thousands of "anti-corruption professionals" and finest brains/scholars involved for decades in practising/improving the anti-corruption work that sheer street smartedness was trying to hijack the agenda and too through an extremely shoddy and totally poorly conceptualised idea like "LP" or JLP" Bill.

Nothing was more anti-democratic than imposing (as a motley group of five) themselves on the nation a sole saviours or conscience-keepers of the nation. Is that the idea of a "participative democracy" or serving personal agenda through "mobocracy"?

Will Lokayukta Bill" not be drafted through participative democratic process,which surely is a time-consuming process,when done in a cool-headed manner? What a part of the "absolutely reasoned/seasoned strategy" could be has been shared with many and Sh S Roy is going to place it for the knowledge of the members of this forum too .

Yes, pl go through my comments sent to the Standing Committee and be enlightened as to what Statute - formation exercise should be and how.   people will feel cheated and indignant for having been taken for a ride. No one sticks one's neck out on knowing what the perfectionist professional /legal mechanism is in anti-corruption crusade,and that how this has already for long been demanded in appropriate fora, without taking to the streets through a deviant donation-collection system.

I would,as a professional/researcher in anti-corruption arena (for decades) request the masses not to let themselves down and be wisened on going through my articulation on LPB. Not the best way to sermonise ad infinitum on the holistic anti-corruption strategy/management/operation. Wait,pl wait.this too, will be done in public domain shortly.S P Mathur IPS DGP(retd) BE MBA PhD

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone
                                                         
Dr. Abhishek Manu Singhviji
Chairman
Standing Committee on AR & PG
Rajya Sabha
New Delhi
 
Sir,
 
Sub: Lokpal Bill 2011-Suggestion and comments-regarding
 
As the time available to register suggestions and comments is not sufficient, I am unable to present an alternative draft of my own, nor am I able to offer very comprehensive comments at this juncture, but could do so positively, if given an opportunity to present myself before the Committee headed by you.
 
The limited areas on which I would like to offer my comments are given as below:
 
GENERAL: Any Statute has to pass through the acid that  of:
·        Necessity
·        Legality
·        Practicality
 
It has then to be subjected to next line of sieve consisting of techno management tools comprising  of :
 SWOT  analysis , and
 
DATT (The Bono's 10 famous principles of creative decision making -Direct Attention Thinking Tools) & Deming's theory of Profound Knowledge.
 
At next stage come the concepts of scientific decision-making process,  using decision-tree and pay-off matrix/matrices.
This work is assisted – or has to be assisted necessarily – by regression/multiple regression analysis so that decision-making is truly evidence-based and could pass the due diligence muster, mandated by SC. 
                                                     
Nothing can - and should - be done in haste just because historically delay in decision-making has taken place. Two wrongs DON''T A RIGHT MAKE. No dilatory tactics also could be applied or 'paralysis by analysis' (Unwarranted nit picking) for extraneous considerations, resorted to.
 
Your great wisdom, at individual and collective level, could set a fine balance. This Valuable suggestion is made to avoid recourse to extreme positions as advocated by many people/groups.
 
SPECIFIC
 
(i) Selection of Lokpal (Chairman/Members)
Must be fair and merit-based as also transparent and seen to be so. Screening committees and Selection Committee should have 50% non-officials (eminent & relevant personnel) who are conversant with the process of HR assessment.
 
(ii) Coverage
·                    Lokpal must cover the PM (in serving capacity also) for legal, practical & psychological reasons. With PMO adopting RFD (Result Framework Documentation) and becoming increasingly transparent, there is no valid reason to fear that vexatious and frivolous complaints would harm the power and position/performance of the PM.
 
Safeguards are, of course, possible like agreement by half or two thirds of Lokpal Members agreeing to take up Enquiry/Investigation. Certain sensitive areas like 'international relations', 'nuclear programmes/test', 'national security' etc could be kept out of the purview of Lokpal.
 
If the PM is not included, all the Ministries, directly under the charge of the PM, will get excluded from the purview of Lokpal and that would be an anti-thesis of the spirit of Lokpal legislation. Arguments against the common law of equality are devoid of merit, and any evidence and apprehensions are purely misplaced. Previous Standing Committees have agreed to the inclusion of The PM under Lokpal coverage, and nothing has changed since then.
 
This one single provision would act as master stoke to create pervasive deterrence. Not only this, the PMO, acting proactively, wouldn't allow any    
 Minister or high profile functionary to act in corrupt/dishonest manner.
 
The nation is not vertically divided over this issue. Just a microscopic minority, for unresearched and unimaginative reasons, has been taking a contrarian view.
 
·                    Judiciary could be covered under Judicial Accountability Bill. This is now generally agreed to. An important import of their concept is that Lokpal institution doesn't have to - and just can't-provide omnibus coverage to all types of personnel/agencies/ organisations.
 
·                    While the conduct of MPs, within the Parliament (under Art 105)  could be kept out of the purview of Lokpal there is absolutely no justification in keeping their conduct outside parliament out of Lokpal purview, specifically in view of SC judgment, declaring MPs as public servants. The parliamentarians should rise above 'party line' and 'privileged' position and support the move to look like commoners in the eyes of law and common people. It's essential also to redeem the practically low esteem in which they are held by the masses at large, their exalted positions and unaccounted privileges notwithstanding. They, as public representatives, must set an example (of leadership) of probity in public life, rather than find cover behind fig leaf of technicalities, or assailable like of arguments.
 
·                    The lower bureaucracy (below JS level) must be kept out of the purview of Lokpal. The statistics of CVC/CBI indicate that there has never been any problem in handling their cases specially as they don't enjoy  great clout/power and have very little discretion to indulge in corrupt practices at mega level.
 
Lokpal is a premier institution. There is no need to use a sledge hammer to kill a fly. Lokpal institution has been conceptualized as part of 'gap analysis' to cover high profile /powerful functionaries over which traditionally CBI/CVC hasn't been able to provide requisite cover. CVC's Annual Reports speak volume on this subject.
 
Thousands or lakhs of cases could clog the functionaries of premier institution like Lokpal. Also the modern management principles talk in terms of decentralisation of administrative work and about lean organisations.
 
The current concept of vigilance at unit/departmental level and enquiry/investigation at CBI/CVC level could be – rather must be – improved through greater autonomy/empowerment & thoughts check-list based system, as also through point-of-action proportionate accountability system.
 
·                    The best way to kill Lokpal, in infancy, is to have lower judiciary under Lokpal, directly or indirectly. Once corruption at high places get  nipped in the bud, cascading effect, ripple effect, and deterrence in varied form  would automatically prevent harassment/corruption at lower level.
·                    For the same reasons as given for lower bureaucracy; all other types of personnel/agencies (NGOs, Associations etc) must be kept out of purview of Lokpal.
Its not one-stop shop for combatting deviant behavior on part of different types of personnel/ organisations. Like Judicial Accountability Bill taking care of judiciary, other Statutes need to be created to handle malfunctioning of media/NGOs/Associations etc.  The Lokpal, as the very objective of the Bill says, is to handle corruption at high places.  It's an open and shut case for exclusion of stray types of personnel/agencies for coverage under Lokpal.
 
(iii) Functions:
'Less to do more' must be the motto for premier institution like Lokpal. Quality work and not the quantity must be the Organisation's functional philosophy. Check-list based enquiries and investigation in time-bound manner could produce desired result. One doesn't shoot 100 rounds to shoe away 100 pigeon's perched on the tree-top. Media management, for deterrence does the trick even in just a few cases, possibly in one single case.
 
Lokpal shouldn't handle administrative work of disciplinary action like employee's dismissal etc; as ab-initio itself it's contrary to legal/constitutional provisions. People using PIL with information obtained through RTI could always question if the State/ Departments give scant/ inadequate attention to Lokpal's recommendations. With an independent investigative wing under its control, enjoying the powers of police station and, clothed with all legal provisions it could handle searches, seizures and arrests etc, of course in cautious manner.These personnel, from different departments/organisations could initially be taken on deputation , and later, if necessary ,be absorbed also. Direct recruitment,at some stage, could also be thought of purposefully. That would be the only way to maintain requisite independence of the investigation wing, something  seen to be missing from the current system of functioning of CBI/ED/IT etc.
 
For work-in-progress etc, on receipt of complaints, Lokpal, on enquiry, could seek reports and make recommendations for avoidance of irregularities /malpractices and corrupt practices.
 
Wherever administrative powers are available with existing Authorities the same should not be tinkered with, for if the righteous (looking) recommendations of Lokpal are ignored or rejected (even indirectly through delay) people could seek remedy through PIL, getting requisite information under RTI. There must be no question of overreach for Lokpal for it to look like a monstrous institution.
 
Lokpal's functions must be in sync with its basic objectives.
 
(iv) Lokayukta:
If under RTI Act, 2005 & Electricity Act, 2003, State level Institutions could be conceived & set up, why likewise under the central legislstion (Lokpal Bill 2011) provision for Lokayukta at state level can't be there? Under Art 252,just if 2 States  agree, State Lokayukta's could be set up there and other States could follow-up  the model or could eventually even be covered under  the same Act. Existing Lokayukta's could get subsumed under the new provision like CVC was when CVC Act 2003 came into being.  State Lokayuktas on the model of Lokpal need to cover high level functionaries only to provide punch and quality work. The existing state vigilance and anti-corruption mechanism could - and should-be strengthened to take care of lower level functionaries. A bench-marked service delivery mechanism, through a separate State level legislation should take care of petty level corruption. It would take care of the day-to-day issues of harassment / hassle/corruption/delay with which the common people are concerned with.
 
(v) Citizen's Charter
However important this subject might look,it has simply nothing to do with Lokpal as this issue needs to be dealt with through wholly different mechanism/institutions/statutes.
 
Just by making mention of citizen's charter in Lokpal Bill no purpose will be served. This issue requires separate serious consideration & consultation,some what beyond the levels provided for currently by the Department of personnel and public grievences. A comprehensive note on this issue will be shared separately.
 
S.P.MATHUR
IPS DGP (Retd)
BE MBA PhD
03.09.2011



-----Original Message-----
From: Girender Singh <girinder_singh@yahoo.com>
Sender: indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net
Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 03:33:47


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