Re: [IAC#RG] Fwd: OROP

Completely agree with Mr Roy, Mr. Ramani and Mr. Kapoor. 50,000 crores in pension to defence chaps every year. Plus the added burden of OROP. While the overwhelming majority of people of India, like me, Mr. Kapoor and Mr Roy, get not a penny in pension and get cleaned out with an acute medical illness, this whining by former soldiers doesnt end. We are so sorry we had greedy fellows like you to man my borders. And mind you it is voluntary. I have covered defence and visited their remote locations. We have kept our lips sealed in national interest about the goings on. Ketchup colonel is nothing. There are many good guys in defence but unfortunately the greedy ones dominate. STOP IT WILL YOU.  Best wishes. Sandeep Dikshit.

On 29 Sep 2015 11:04, "AV Ramani" <av.ramani@gmail.com> wrote:

SHAME ON RETIRED DEFENCE SERVICE PERSONNELS WHO MADE MOCKERY OF SERVICES MOTTO

AV RAMANI BE MTECH IIT KGP

On Mon, Sep 28, 2015 at 10:12 AM, Satish Kumar Kapoor <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net> wrote:

Dear Sarbajit ji

I agree with you.

Unfortunately these veterans do not want to listen other side

I stopped discussions because these people started talking nonsense

One officer went to extent that you, your father, your grandfather ran away from Pakistan during partition to save your lives , you are refugees etc etc

As such it does not make any sense to discuss with such a peoples.

S.K.Kapoor

On Sunday, September 27, 2015 6:19 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Brig Saha

It seems our veterans lose their ability to detect friend from foe
once they retire if you lot routinely dish out terms like "traitor" to
describe your channel hosts.

FYI, I am not a babu. Neither do I get any pension / salary from the Govt.

What "I" am is the poor fool who pays for all the worthless and
whining rascals hiding behind terms like patriotism and nationalism
for their greedy / selfish ends. I am the person who pays for  ketchup
colonels and their fake encounters. I am the person who pays for
Adarsh Housing scams. ...

You people were paid enough for any work you allegedly did while in
service. If you couldn't save while you were in service I fail to see
why we citizens should pay for your existence and your booze once you
retire. (NB: By "you" I mean each and every person who gets a pension
- starting from our worthless MPs)

I am sure that many ordinary citizens would say much the same thing
once we leave the hypocrisy behind.

Best regards
.
Sarbajit

On 9/27/15, kashi saha <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net> wrote:
> Sarabjt,
> Why you donot you spk of the harm done by the your patriotic IAS super babus
> by blackmailing the Politicians. When  a person joins a service with certain
> terms and conditions through Gazette notification how can it be changed to
> down grade the same in pay and pension. All veterans and those who defended
> the nation till 1971, are all pre 1973 order issued removing the OROP and
> pension quantum( 70% of last pay drawn). Those are people fighting in
> peaceful manner trying to bring sense into these people in power.
> You are asking us to fight with you( It seems from your comment you are one
> of those glorified Babu  ) to bring down your self enhanced privileges, why
> is our job you deserve it or not you convince the Govt. what we are
> interested is a parity you increase yours increase ours too. You do not do
> any thing extra to contribute to the nation. You do your bit and we do our
> bit. If you fail we take on the job even if it is messed up so that the
> nation do not suffer. and if we fail in our job you can only suck your
> thumb. What you IAS/IFS and Political Nexus have done so far:
> 1. In 1971,You messed up the with your foreign policy with Bangladesh after
> the liberation. And it is a thorn on our back, a small helmet for terrorist
> and entry point of CFCurrency and terrorist . A proactive policy could have
> avoided all this
> 2. After 1971 You messed up with your policy against Pak even after we had
> handed over a trophy of more than 90K Pak POW., you could have bargained all
> our POW and POK.
> 3. In 1947 You messed up the Kashmir by asking us to Ceasefire when we were
> in the verge of taking over now so called POK
> 4. Twice we took over Strategic passes in Kashmir you forced us to hand them
> over now the Chinese with their armed forces have a strategic road to PAK.
> 5. Srilanka you created a problem and now we are loosing it to China.
> 6. Myanmar oil pipeline to China again failed in your foreign policy.
> 7. Internally Naxal, NE interstate relationship, sharing of water allocation
> of development fund and projects , you failed every where.
> Why IAS?? to protected constitution at national interest irrespective of
> party in power, advise the politicians who are masses rep against
> unconstitutional, antinational actions. Look into your self are doing that.
> How can any one justify subsidized food for the MPs, pensions with OROP
> principle for the MP with even one election win, There are few Khemkas and
> Chatuvedis but majority of you are self serving un patriot, with yes sir
> attitude for kushy transfer Children studying abroad and after 60 years Apex
> scale pension and member of a commission.
> You are the traitors and need to be sorted out not the politicians.
> Jai Hind        Brigadier Kashi Nath Saha  Mob: 9810728364 Email:
> knsaha44@yahoo.com

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[IAC#RG] NBA again hauled over SC coals in Sanjiv Bhat judgment

http://supremecourtofindia.nic.in/FileServer/2015-10-13_1444718418.pdf

Controversial IPS officer Sanjiv Bhat claims his email ID was unauthorisedly hacked and submits proof he complained to the DIG of "Economic Offences Wing" Delhi Police about it. The court in turn says it cannot understand why such a senior IPS officer complains to the EOW which is not at all concerned with offences like hacking of emails. (para 36 of the judgment)

The Court then goes on to castigate Mr. Bhat and the NBA on the basis of rival versions these emails.

Without going into the merits of what anybody has said in pleadings - especially when IAC has more than enough reason to be upset with Mr. Saniv Bhat for making wild and incorrect statements about IAC at instance of the same NGO and their senior advocate - it is very surprising that the senior most judges of India are not aware of the functions of the Economic Offences Wing of Delhi Police and its much touted Cyber Crime Cell, and had proceeded to malign a litigant on basis of "hacked" emails (and also apparently without following the evidentiary procedures for proving electronic documents specified in Information Technology Act).

"ECONOMIC OFFENCES WING, DELHI POLICE MISSION STATEMENT"
http://www.delhipolice.nic.in/mission-st.html

"CYBER CRIMES
The Cyber Crime Cell of EOW strives to be pro-active in adopting modern methods of investigation by continuously upgrading its capabilities to face the challenge of ever-increasing cyber crimes. It creates awareness amongst students and general public about such crimes."

Not surprisingly Mr. (Retd) Markandey Katju has something to say:
http://thewire.in/2015/10/15/the-supreme-courts-remarks-against-sanjiv-bhatt-violate-its-own-earlier-verdicts-13295/

Sarbajit

Re: [IAC#RG] Unform Civil Code

Sarbajit!

We already have a uniform (secular) civil code for those who want it! Was that meant to be a joke?

ravi

On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:01 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Ravi,

We already have a uniform (secular) civil code for those who want it.
Actually it has always been the Hindus who opposed the secular Civil
Code (which long precedes the Hindu Code of 1955).

1) Hindu Marriage Act 1955 <==> Special Marriages Act (1872/ 1954)
2) Hindu Succession Act 1956 <==> Indian Succession Act 1925
3) Hindu Guardianship Act1956  <==> Guardians and Wards Act 1890

For eg., the Hindu Marriage Act 1955 is almost a xerox copy of the old
(pre-1954) Special Marriages Act.

It is clear from this simple analysis that the self styled 'thekedars'
of Hinduism who are HQed in Nagpur continue to speak in the forked
tongues of their reptilian American pay-masters and now intend to
impose their retrograde US drafted communal UCC on the secular
citizens of India, probably via the Supreme Court (which is now packed
with their camp followers) predetermined PIL route.

Sarbajit

On 10/13/15, Ravindran P M <raviforjustice@gmail.com> wrote:
> ... I need to conclude by asking: why is
> it that we still do not have a
> uniform civil code through out the nation, including J&K? Religion, being a
> personal choice,
> shouldn't it be left purely in the personal domain?
>
> ravi
>
> On Thu, Oct 1, 2015 at 10:06 AM, Seema Mustafa <seemamustafa@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>

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--

Veteran Major P M Ravindran

http://raviforjustice.blogspot.com

 

You may also like to visit:

'Judiciary Watch' at www.vigilonline.com 

http://www.judicialreforms.org/

http://www.roguepolice.com

http://milapchoraria.tripod.com

[IAC#RG] FASCISM: CREEPING IN OR ALREADY HERE?

http://www.thecitizen.in/NewsDetail.aspx?Id=5559&FASCISM:/CREEPING/IN/OR/ALREADY/HERE?


Seema Mustafa
thecitizen.in

Re: [IAC#RG] Fwd: OROP

Dear Sarbjit,

You are very right in the observations that you have made. The Army, at least, does require reforms. But you overlook some aspects which have direct bearing on the issue raised by you.

 The first one is that the soldiers & officers of the Armed Forces are also citizens of the country as also in the case of other armies of the world. It is these citizens who are suitably selected, disciplined and trained to become soldiers and officers in the Armed Forces. Hence, our National Characteristics remain ingrained into them. These 'characteristics' such as selfishness, over-arching ambition beyond one's capabilities, opportunism, nepotism, favour-seeking, dishonesty and craftiness do not go away merely by training and discipline. We as a nation require a phase of thorough 'Human Resource Development' in order to come up to a comparable standard to other nations. Unfortunately, our leader remain oblivious to such national failings. In the absence of such corrective action, however, these moral qualities are sliding down further and further. I am in my early eighties and in the course of my life, thus far, I have seen these standards deteriorating not only in the Army but also in the civil life. Even though, the strict discipline and threat of certain and quick retribution keeps these under check to quite some extent, in the Armed Forces, as compared to the Civil Life. It is, however, very difficult to keep Armed Forces as an 'island of virtue' in a 'quagmire of evil'. They cannot be kept isolated from civil in their cantonments, to a greater extent than at present. After all, they do come in contact with their Civil counterparts, relations, friends and acquaintances in their day to day functioning and especially during their leave. They see what is happening outside the Armed Forces and internally rebel against the disciplined system that binds them. Hence, whenever they get an opportunity, they also tend to taste the 'forbidden fruit'.

Hence, these malaise are not only with the Armed Forces but more so with the Civil Society. Till the time that it was rectified at the roots from where the Armed Forces Personnel come, we cannot get rid of these ills completely.

But that does not mean that one should accept these as a 'fait accompli'. Because, such afflictions are much more dangerous and injurious in the Armed Forces and require urgent corrections than in the Civil. In the Armed Forces, the authorities are generally very alert to such ills and do take corrective actions with much more alacrity than in the Civil. But then, again, there are other set of our negative National Characteristics such as 'Complacency', 'Status quo ante' attitude and sheer indolence that hinder positive and drastic action.

Added to the above, is the discriminatory treatment of the Armed Forces by the politicians and bureaucrats. Leave aside the OROP, the protocol of the Armed Forces as compared to the All India Services has been systematically lowered. They have given themselves Non-Functional Upgrade (NFU), a hefty rise, and via that also OROP but have denied the same to the Armed Forces. The pension of the other ranks in the Armed Forces was lowered in 1973 from 70% of last salary to 50% of salary while at the same time increasing pension of Civil Services from 30% of salary to 50% of salary. These could not have been done without consent of the politicians in charge. These discriminatory dealings affect morale of the Armed Forces and do not help in eradication of evils indicated by you. Why should only the Armed Forces be concerned about swelling pension budgets while the others are so liberal with their own emoluments and pensions? The concern that you have raised for heavy pension budgets must be tackled by the Govt on equitable terms and not only for the Armed Forces.

There is yet another aspect that of 'proof of the pudding'. While the Armed Forces have performed their Role well and to the appreciation of the Nation in every aspect whether it was in war or in peace, the Civil Services have been found wanting in the fulfilment of their Role badly. See the maladministration everywhere, numerous multi-crore corruption scandals, sad state of law and order and so on. In fact, I am reminded of a couplet in Urdu: "Rag rag mein hai naasoor, nashtar lagaein kahaan kahaan"; meaning that 'the malady is wide-spread in the body, in every vein; where all should we operate'. Under these circumstances, you be the judge as to, who deserved better salaries and pensions: the Armed Forces or the Civil Services.

As to the denouncing of 'political' generals and admirals, I can assure you that the personnel of the Armed Forces especially the officer resent such actions hugely. But unlike in the Civil Services where a movement was started (some time back) to find 'the most corrupt IAS officer' in UP, in the Armed Forces such movements cannot be allowed. these not only affect their morale but also leads to extreme indiscipline. Hence, these need to be tackled by the Govt. Why do the politicians interfere in the rank structure of Armed Forces at the higher echelons? Why the various state Govts are allowed to bid for their candidates in the higher echelons of Armed Forces? It is they who should desist from such actions and let fairness play its intended role.

Maintaining strong and efficient Armed Forces is an all round responsibility of the politicians, bureaucrats, academics, in fact, the entire Nation at large.

Regards,

Randhir Phagura

Maj Gen

On Tue, Oct 20, 2015 at 8:34 PM, Jagdish Nauni <jagdishnauni@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Sarabjit

Apologies for not replying to your mail earlier and now also I will only say that every right thinking Offr of the Indian Armed Forces and may be even every Indian who has any concern for such matters will agree with "last para of your mail". And be rest assured that any issue of corruption in the Armed Forces you raise, you will find me among your front line supporters.

It does not mean that I agree with every thing you have written, may be in next few days I will give my comments. Not that I want to drag you for any worthless discussion but because I am sure, if I am able to clear you bias,exchanging ideas with you will be really worth it. As it is, in the past on many occasions I have voted in favour of many issues against corruption your group has raised

Warm Regard

Col Jagdish Nauni, Veteran

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 1:50 AM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

This message is eligible for Automatic Cleanup! (sroy.mb@gmail.com) Add cleanup rule | More info

Dear Col Nauni,

If you play the patriotism card with us to make your case we can easily trump with corruption and politicised Army cards

I can't possibly disagree with your list of 'shaheeds' and what the institution of the Army stand for.. It is the same concern for the INSTITUTION that causes me to speak out against the spiraling RAT-RACE for pensions encapsulated by OROP.

Do you not  sense that future govts will be so overwhelmed by burgeoning pension payments to veterans that they will be forced to CUT DOWN on the FUTURE manpower. Doesn't anybody teach basic maths like 1+1<>3 in the Army - or the laws of EXPONENTIATION?

Its the same kind of problem Japan faced with its pension scheme, the contributions from young workers in a highly automated robotised environment were insufficient for payments to retireees who were living longer and longer. The pension contributions from the young grew so large that employers could not afford to keep so many permanent employees leading to massive job cutbacks and increasing automation. Japan consequently had a huge population of unemployed youth caused by its bloated social security system skewed to keep the old alive.

Are faujis so self-centred nowadays that they can't see that this OROP agitation is inspired by vested interests who want to whittle down India's standing army and its biggest asset -- our soldiers. Have you ever wondered that Mr. Anil Ambani is now being encouraged to enter Defence production after mucking up every almost business he had turned his hand to ?

Beyond Col Ketchup I could have equally cited lesser known names like Brig/Maj.Gen/Lt.Gen S.K.Sahni who got promoted thrice using highly litigative tactics in Delhi High Court and misled many officers like Lt.Gen.Kishan Pal to recommend him as a jolly good fellow. And what to speak of Lt.Gen Dahiya who accused Gen Sahni of being out to fix him as tit-for-tat.

And how about Gen V.K Singh who supposedly tried to fix Gen DS Suhaag to ensure the line of succession for his own daughter's father-in-law Gen A.K.Singh to be next COAS ?

Anyone reading the judgments of service matters and CoIs for Armed forces will be amazed at the lengths "you people" will go to to get promoted to the General staff.

And how is it that Gen VK Singh never objected that Admiral Ramdas and other foreign financed veterans interceded on his behalf on the D-o-B issue. As far as we are concerned the whole bloody lot on both sides at the top were equally corrupt and selfish when it comes for ensuring "their" lines of succession and their pensions.

PS: I am sure that you also recall the insufferable Gen B.M Kaul and his forward policy 'qua' China which caused 1962 and so much loss of life, prestige and territory.

In such light  do you disagree that there should be a total separation of Army and politicians, and the highly politicised Generals and Admirals should be roundly denounced from within the services ? Do you not also agree that the procedure for selection of the service chiefs must be foolproof and ensure their autonomy and integrity ?

Sarbajit

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[HumJanenge] Though delayed, after protracted battle with corrupt Odisha bureaucracy and inefficient, lethargic and law-ignorant Odisha Information Commission, RTI Activists achieved outstanding victory in ensuring justice to BPL people and downtrodden masses

Though delayed, after protracted  battle with corrupt Odisha bureaucracy  and inefficient, lethargic and law-ignorant Odisha  Information Commission, RTI Activists achieved outstanding   victory in ensuring justice to BPL people and downtrodden masses

·           Tall claim of Nabin Patnaik Govt as Champion of poor is proved false and sheer deception.

·           Though  the BPL people  are  entitled  to get  information free of cost under  section 7 (5)  of the RTI Act, the State Government  continues  to deny  the information free of cost  since last 10 years.

·           Decade-long Rally, Dharana, demonstration of the RTI Activists demanding to enforce section 7(5) of the RTI Act did not yield any result. The corrupt bureaucracy remained adamant to do all illegality to harass BPL people by depriving them of their legitimate right to get the information free of cost.

·           Astonishingly, Odisha Information  Commission ( represented by  Sri D.N. Padhi, former Odisha Chief Information Commissioner, Sri Jagadanand, former  State Information Commissioner, Prof. Radhamohan, Former Information Commissioner, Sri Tarun Kanti Mishra, former Chief Information Commissioner ) whose mandate is to protect law  was found establishing  unholy alliance with corrupt bureaucracy  and behaved as dreaded  criminals to subvert  RTI   and giving illegal  direction  to  the   PIOs  to collect fees for information from the BPL people and deprived  crores of BPL people of their legitimate right.  The illegal direction of the Commission was challenged by RTI Activists in High Court.

·           Exploring ways and means in order to provide justice to the BPL-RTI-Applicants, RTI Activists knocked at the door of Judiciary not once but twice seeking direction to State Government to comply section 7(5) of the RTI Act.

·           In June, 2015, The Hon'ble Odisha High Court finally gave the direction to State Govt.  to issue  Gazette notification to provide information to the BPL people free of cost.

·           At last, the State Govt.  was forced  to issue  Notification  to  provide  information the BPL people free of cost.

·           Now, the BPL-RTI-Applicants are entitled to get the information amounting thousands of rupees free of cost.

·           We the RTI Activists   will remain alert not only enforcing and monitoring it but exposing anti-RTI character of Odisha Govt.  and Odisha Information Commission in the days to come.      

Dear friends

 Right to Information Act  which came into force  on 12^th October, 2005  has  mandate  to enforce a transparent  and accountable  governance system in the  country  and  giving  right  to the Citizens to access the  information held  by the Public Authorities.  As per section 7 (5) of the Act, the BPL people are required not to pay any kind of fee i.e., fee for application {section 6 (1) }, fee for  information {section-7(1)}, fee for information in electronic format {section 7(5)}. But  while framing the Rules  i.e,  Odisha RTI Rules, 2005, the State Government  made a provision ( Rule-4) of only making application fee for BPL people free of cost while allowing other  fees  like fee for information to be  collected  from them. Though the law is  supreme, but  the State  Govt. gave the direction to the officials  to implement the  law  following  the  illegal provisions of  Odisha  RTI Rules.  This arrangement made by the State Govt.   gave unbridled power to the PIO  to collect the fees  from BPL people for  information.  

 Though it  was illegal, the Odisha Information  Commission  joined  hand with State bureaucracy  and  endorsed and ensured   this illegality  by  giving  direction to the PIOs  to collect  from BPL people the fees for  information.   Sri D.N.Padhi who is  a corrupt bureaucrat  and joined  as First Odisha Chief Information Commissioner , while adjudicating   Complaint Case 11 and 12/2006  directed  the BPL people  to pay the fees  for information violating section 7(5) of the RTI Act.   It was vehemently opposed by RTI Activists. The Information Commission was publicly condemned for their act of illegality.  As Sri D.N. Padhi is man of shrewd character, he, while hearing Complaint cases directed the BPL people to pay the fees for information but did not mention it in proceeding of the case.   Under pressure from RTI Activists, the Commission made a recommendation to State Govt.  on 16.11.2007  to  provide  BPL people  information  of 75 pages ( Rs. 150.00)   free of cost.  But the State Govt.  did not give any importance to this recommendation and  continued with their mandate  to  collect the fees from BPL people.

Campaign of RTI Activists continued   and exposing anti-BPL mindset of Odisha Information Commission and State Government. In May, 2013, Sri Jagadanandi Mohanty, then State Information Commissioner while addressing a  Workshop on RTI  in  Collectorate Conference Hall, Malkangiri  spoke about  misuse of RTI by non-BPL people  who are seeking  information  in the name of the BPL people  to get the information free of cost. A lot of complaints in connection of this issue have come to the notice of the Commission.  Sri Tapan Padhi, prominent RTI Activist who was present there, then filed an RTI Application to the office of Odisha Information Commission seeking information about details of Complaint Cases filed about misuse of RTI quoting statement of Sri Jagadanand Mohanty.   In response to RTI Application,  the PIO said that  there was no such information available  in the Commission. The dangerous character of Sri Jagadanand Mohanty to satisfy all illegalities of the State Government and spreading misleading information in public domain was found true.

Campaign of RTI Activists took a turn, when Sri Tarun Kanti Mishra, then State Chief Information Commissioner while adjudicating a Complaint case No. 2028/11 gave direction to Sri Kunja Bikari Patra, BPL-Applicant and RTI Activist of Nayagarh district to pay the fees for information, though he pleaded to get the information free of cost under section 7 (5) of the RTI Act.  The direction of the Commission  was challenged by Sri Kunja Bihari Patra  in Odisha High Court. While  disposing the case ( W.P.C. No.- 4797/13) on 3.7.13, the High Court quashed  the decision of the Commission as illegal  and directed the PIO to provide the information free of cost  in observance of section 7 (5) of the RTI Act.

This is one step achievement of RTI Activists to provide justice  to the BPL people.  This judgement was highlighted, largely circulated and demanded to all the Public Authorities to provide information to the BPL people free of cost. Being pressurised by the RTI Activists, the Odisha Information Commission   made a direction to the State Govt. on 31.3.14 to issue notification  observing direction of Odisha High Court.

The corrupt bureaucracy remained adamant   and continued to collect the fees from BPL people. Then, Sri Dhoba Sahu, BPL-Applicant and RTI Activist of Kalahandi district  who was denied  the information free of cost , filed  a  Writ Petition No. 135/15 in Odisha High Court seeking  direction   to State Govt. to provide all BPL people  the information free of cost.  On 23.7.15, the High Court  gave the direction  to  State Govt. to  Comply  section  7 (5) of the RTI Act.  On 21.9.15, the State Govt. has finally issued  notification  to  all the Public Authorities to provide the BPL people information free of cost.

Our   legal battle  for withdrawal of compulsory RTI Application, illegal provision of  submission of proof of Citizenship at the time of  submitting RTI Application, providing  copy of the decisions of the  Commission in Odia language  is still going  on  and the case pending in Odisha High Court.   

Pradip Pradhan

State Convener

Odisha Soochana Adhikar Abhijan

M-9937843482

Date- 20.10.15 

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Re: [IAC#RG] Fwd: OROP

Dear Sarabjit

Apologies for not replying to your mail earlier and now also I will only say that every right thinking Offr of the Indian Armed Forces and may be even every Indian who has any concern for such matters will agree with "last para of your mail". And be rest assured that any issue of corruption in the Armed Forces you raise, you will find me among your front line supporters.

It does not mean that I agree with every thing you have written, may be in next few days I will give my comments. Not that I want to drag you for any worthless discussion but because I am sure, if I am able to clear you bias,exchanging ideas with you will be really worth it. As it is, in the past on many occasions I have voted in favour of many issues against corruption your group has raised

Warm Regard

Col Jagdish Nauni, Veteran

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 1:50 AM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

This message is eligible for Automatic Cleanup! (sroy.mb@gmail.com) Add cleanup rule | More info

Dear Col Nauni,

If you play the patriotism card with us to make your case we can easily trump with corruption and politicised Army cards

I can't possibly disagree with your list of 'shaheeds' and what the institution of the Army stand for.. It is the same concern for the INSTITUTION that causes me to speak out against the spiraling RAT-RACE for pensions encapsulated by OROP.

Do you not  sense that future govts will be so overwhelmed by burgeoning pension payments to veterans that they will be forced to CUT DOWN on the FUTURE manpower. Doesn't anybody teach basic maths like 1+1<>3 in the Army - or the laws of EXPONENTIATION?

Its the same kind of problem Japan faced with its pension scheme, the contributions from young workers in a highly automated robotised environment were insufficient for payments to retireees who were living longer and longer. The pension contributions from the young grew so large that employers could not afford to keep so many permanent employees leading to massive job cutbacks and increasing automation. Japan consequently had a huge population of unemployed youth caused by its bloated social security system skewed to keep the old alive.

Are faujis so self-centred nowadays that they can't see that this OROP agitation is inspired by vested interests who want to whittle down India's standing army and its biggest asset -- our soldiers. Have you ever wondered that Mr. Anil Ambani is now being encouraged to enter Defence production after mucking up every almost business he had turned his hand to ?

Beyond Col Ketchup I could have equally cited lesser known names like Brig/Maj.Gen/Lt.Gen S.K.Sahni who got promoted thrice using highly litigative tactics in Delhi High Court and misled many officers like Lt.Gen.Kishan Pal to recommend him as a jolly good fellow. And what to speak of Lt.Gen Dahiya who accused Gen Sahni of being out to fix him as tit-for-tat.

And how about Gen V.K Singh who supposedly tried to fix Gen DS Suhaag to ensure the line of succession for his own daughter's father-in-law Gen A.K.Singh to be next COAS ?

Anyone reading the judgments of service matters and CoIs for Armed forces will be amazed at the lengths "you people" will go to to get promoted to the General staff.

And how is it that Gen VK Singh never objected that Admiral Ramdas and other foreign financed veterans interceded on his behalf on the D-o-B issue. As far as we are concerned the whole bloody lot on both sides at the top were equally corrupt and selfish when it comes for ensuring "their" lines of succession and their pensions.

PS: I am sure that you also recall the insufferable Gen B.M Kaul and his forward policy 'qua' China which caused 1962 and so much loss of life, prestige and territory.

In such light  do you disagree that there should be a total separation of Army and politicians, and the highly politicised Generals and Admirals should be roundly denounced from within the services ? Do you not also agree that the procedure for selection of the service chiefs must be foolproof and ensure their autonomy and integrity ?

Sarbajit

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RE: [IAC#RG] Unform Civil Code

18/10/15

The concept of public welfare and its relationship with governance under a totalitarian regime and/ or a religiously fanatical regime and a democratic regime has to be clearly understood. Today all the three types are ostensibly working  in the name of and for the public wefare of the masses.

As a totalitarian regime we tend to think of communism as practiced by Russia and other countries with similar practices. Unfortunately here the power gets concentrated in a group of leaders and to maintain their grip on power undermine the interest and welfare of the masses.

Under Fanatical regime we can think of any of the Middle Eastern regime,wealthy  but working for their welfare of their own tribes or religious adeherents  and against followers of other religions.

As a democracy you can think of U.S and Europe. But they have also accepted the public welfare as essential part of governance.

India is basket case- all three rolled into one- democratic as a constitution, totalitarian in its governance and religiously fanatical-caste ridden at the base level.

Tendency to raise a finger at U.S. as a devil for all the ills that are of own making , is not going to help in solving them

whether it is the uniform civil code or forked tongue of RSS. But it makes me wonder where was RSS in 1955 when Nehru passed Hindu Code bill in post haste ? RSS was on the backfoot ,on the verge of being banned in the aftermath of the Assasination of Mahtama Gandhi. Nehru always maintained that he can manage the Hindus but not the Muslims after his experience with Jinnah and the threat of civil war before indepence.

Vidyut has a point when she says that many laws seemed to have been passed affecting personal rights without much discussion.

Regds

JKGaur

---

Date: Fri, 16 Oct 2015 12:19:58 +0530
From: r.dua1234@gmail.com
To: indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] Unform Civil Code

Just a thought after going thru the mails.
The concept of 'public welfare' has to be kept at minimum as we have seen any totalitarian concept, be it communism or fanaticism leads to No Good.
Let everyone EARN their laurels.

Ofcourse where Law is concerned our honourable members will know best.
Regards.

On 16 Oct 2015 00:35, "Reformist Navin" <navinpandya1954@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello Friends,

Namaste.

For real & stronger Democracy, need to replace soon bogus Representation of People Act with new perfect law to ensure good governance & public welfare.

Regards,

Navin

Quality of Democracy, Freedom, Laws & Governance depends on the quality of Electoral Laws, Parliament & State Assemblies. Good Governance is a Human Right.

On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:01 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Ravi,

We already have a uniform (secular) civil code for those who want it.
Actually it has always been the Hindus who opposed the secular Civil
Code (which long precedes the Hindu Code of 1955).

1) Hindu Marriage Act 1955 <==> Special Marriages Act (1872/ 1954)
2) Hindu Succession Act 1956 <==> Indian Succession Act 1925
3) Hindu Guardianship Act1956  <==> Guardians and Wards Act 1890

For eg., the Hindu Marriage Act 1955 is almost a xerox copy of the old
(pre-1954) Special Marriages Act.

It is clear from this simple analysis that the self styled 'thekedars'
of Hinduism who are HQed in Nagpur continue to speak in the forked
tongues of their reptilian American pay-masters and now intend to
impose their retrograde US drafted communal UCC on the secular
citizens of India, probably via the Supreme Court (which is now packed
with their camp followers) predetermined PIL route.

Sarbajit

On 10/13/15, Ravindran P M <raviforjustice@gmail.com> wrote:
> ... I need to conclude by asking: why is
> it that we still do not have a
> uniform civil code through out the nation, including J&K? Religion, being a
> personal choice,
> shouldn't it be left purely in the personal domain?
>
> ravi
>
> On Thu, Oct 1, 2015 at 10:06 AM, Seema Mustafa <seemamustafa@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>

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