On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 7:05 PM, <
asim.human@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear all,
> For using any of the teachings of Mahatma Gandhiji we all need to learn
> tolerance. We have to build new nation of Democratic valu in which there
> shall be no importance to Temples and Mosques but more importance shall be
> given to basic infrastructures like building toilets, barrier free
> government offices etc. Civil Rights shall be given priority than any non
> issues to which the fundamentalists always giving hyper imp. The terrorism
> of any colour is disgraceful for good governance. So all good citizens
> should keep distance from such provocative thoughts. The corruption related
> to money is very important but the behavioural corruption, constant mis
> guiding on imp facts are criminal things. All such parties and their leaders
> needs to be taken to forest of south Africa and we shall leave them in deep
> forest from where these dirty persons shall not return back and nature will
> teach them lesson.
> - Asim Sarode
>
> Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone from !DEA
>
> ________________________________
> From: ramans shriman <
msb931@yahoo.com>
> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2011 06:06:07 -0700 (PDT)
> To: <
humjanenge@googlegroups.com>; <
asim.human@gmail.com>
> Cc: <
desiyatra@googlegroups.com>;
> <
stop-corruption-worldwide@googlegroups.com>; <
drtogadia@gmail.com>; VHP
> INT'L HQs DELHI\(Goutam Chatterjee\)<
vhpintlhqs@gmail.com>; Bjp
> Itcell<
bjp.karnataka.itcell.facebook@gmail.com>; Shiv
> Sena<
mazamaharashtra@shivsena.org>; <
karishma_ray@yahoo.com>;
> hindujagruti<
hindu.jagruti@gmail.com>; Hindu media monitoring
> Chennai<
hindumediamonitoringchennai@yahoo.com>
> Subject: they shall all learn democracy and Satyagraha- two will go out
> togather
> since the democracy or dirty democracy is not a product of India ,
> corruption is also not. its evidence n froof is the macauly's notes to uk
> when he toured india.
> the dirty democracy of india n the dirty democracy inspired human behaviour
> of the empowered called corruption have to go togather out of india . one
> will not go n never go w/o the other. two will go out togather
>
> ________________________________
> From: "
asim.human@gmail.com" <
asim.human@gmail.com>
> To:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com > Sent: Tue, June 14, 2011 9:42:47 AM
> Subject: [HumJanenge] Re: they shall all learn democracy and Satyagraha
>
> Dear All,
> Baba Ramdev's statement regarding creating an army with weapons was a great
> dent to the movement against corruption. We all should accept the fact that
> the Yoga Guru is not having perfect-Democratic thought base and
> understanding. The fundamentalist parties like BJP and their allies also
> dented Baba Ramdev's initiative. He allowed the tainted and self proclaimed-
> violent Sadhvi to sit with him on stage was one of the great mistakes.
> Ramdev Baba don't know even 'Sa' of Satyagraha. The issue of Black Money is
> defiantly related our lives as citizens of India but the way to solve it can
> be different than such movements that to led by opportunist Baba Ramdev.
> Anna Hazare is a person with simplicity. And there can not be any doubts
> about him and his motives, like we are having many doubts about Baba Ramdev.
> But we must keep in mind that Anna is not having clear understanding about
> Democracy and Democratic processes. He just likes media and publicity. Anna
> was never a Gandhian in real sense, but now he got to know very clearly that
> 'being Gandhian' is beneficial.
> So with all these flaws we need to accept Anna but we shall not give any
> scope to persons of loose mentality like Ramdev Baba to lead any movements
> related to citizen rights.
> - Adv. Asim Sarode
>
> Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone from !DEA
>
> ________________________________
> From: "Y.P. Anand" <
ypanandindia@yahoo.co.in>
> Sender:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com > Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:34:47 +0530 (IST)
> To: <
humjanenge@googlegroups.com>
> ReplyTo:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] 3 POSITIVE points which Baba, Anna and IAC will
> never ask for
> Dear Shri Devasahayam,
> I agree with you that corruption is a very widespread issue and trying to
> enforce some simplistic or quick-fix solutions in isolation, without a
> deeper study of the issue in its numerous aspects, can only be illusory. I
> feel that such a trend is also the result of self-righteous attitudes which
> are based more on ignorance mixed with arrogance than on a deep
> understanding of the subject.
>
> With regards,
> YP Anand .
>
> ________________________________
> From: Devasahayam MG <
mgd@airtelmail.in>
> To:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com > Sent: Mon, 13 June, 2011 9:05:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] 3 POSITIVE points which Baba, Anna and IAC will
> never ask for
>
> Dear friends,
>
> I have been one of the staunchest opponent of corruption in any form and
> have been closely following this corruption debate. But I am also a follower
> of the Holy Bible. There is a famous passage in the Bible that says "Why do
> you see the speck that is in other's eyes, but do not notice the log that is
> in your own eye?" I hope the message is clear. To make it explicit I will
> reproduce the interview I gave to a Tamil Magazine recently on this theme:
>
> Question 7: As an activist of anti-corruption movement, what is your
> suggested prescription to keep the corruption in check or any headway
> possible in the movement in the coming years? What should be the people's
> role?
>
> Ans. The ongoing commotion about corruption is like six blind men
> describing an elephant by feeling different parts of the animal's body. The
> blind man who feels a leg says the elephant is like a pillar; the one who
> feels the tail says it is like a rope; the one who feels the trunk says it
> is like a tree branch; the one who feels the ear says it is like a hand fan;
> the one who feels the belly says it is like a wall; and the one who feels
> the tusk says it is like a solid pipe.
>
> This is what is happening about corruption, the hydra-headed
> monster which is being understood and described differently by different
> people and in the process concerted and concentrated action to combat the
> evil is not taking place. For this we need first to understand the root
> causes of this all-pervading evil:
>
> 1. Corruption has more to do with our culture and social values. For
> instance the most prevalent social practice of dowry itself is a serious
> form of corruption –girl's parents heavily bribing boy's parents for her to
> be taken into their household. This and other forms of corruption like
> making cash & kind offerings to deities for favours and blindly following
> corrupt and decadent religious priests and preachers are socially and
> culturally rooted in our society. How then can governments and businesses
> escape from this evil?
>
> 2. Our electoral process that brings forth government leaders is riddled
> with corruption and voters are waiting to be bribed with cash and
> 'freebies'. It is but natural that corrupt elections will throw up only
> corrupt government. How then can corruption be eliminated?
>
> 3. Constitution is the charter of India's governance that has established
> some of the finest institutions and instruments of democratic governance
> backed by appropriate laws and legislations. But nearly six decades down the
> line these institutions/instruments have degenerated and lost their capacity
> to govern with the laws and legislations remaining only on paper. There is
> no integrity left in these institutions. What then is the use of enacting
> more laws and creating more institutions?
>
> My prescription therefore would be to focus on elimination of
> societal and electoral corruption and restoration of institutional
> integrity. For this, people need not perform miracles. All they need to do
> is to reject corrupt customs and practices in society, refuse to accept
> 'freebies' and cash as bribe for voting and insist that the institutions and
> instruments of governance perform their tasks as per the laws of the land.
>
> M.G.Devasahayam
>
> _________________________________________________________________________________________
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 8:40 PM, Sarbajit Roy <
sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Dear Satish Ji
>>
>> If you ask me personally I agree with you 100%. However, some of our
>> members (who consider themselves to be corruption fighters) have requested
>> that discussions on LokPal / Anna / Baba etc will be of general interest to
>> many of our members and have requested that discussions be allowed in June
>> also.
>>
>> The Moderators monitor the activity on this group[ very carefully. We try
>> and allow a sufficient degree of free speech on this group which is within
>> the boundaries of decency and rules of debating. Hence this is one of the
>> very few groups where very free and frank (and often with fresh perspective)
>> speech can take place.
>>
>> So I am requesting you also to please put up with this till end of this
>> month. You concern has been carefully noted and we shall endeavour to see
>> that you are not disturbed unduly.
>>
>> At the same time our errant members should take notice that if LKPB
>> discussion overshadows RTI here, the facility will be instantly terninated.
>>
>> Sarbajit
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 8:23 PM, Satish Kumar Kapoor
>> <
kapoorsatish@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Dear Mr Sarbajit,
>>> When some body posts some topics not connected with RTI, u say that this
>>> forum is meant for discussion of RTI matters, then why discuss Lokpal
>>> bill/Anna Hazare/Baba Ramdev etc.
>>> S.K.Kapoor
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: Sarbajit Roy <
sroy.mb@gmail.com>
>>> To:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com >>> Sent: Mon, June 13, 2011 6:04:17 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] 3 POSITIVE points which Baba, Anna and IAC will
>>> never ask for
>>>
>>> I am not afraid of this Bill/Law.
>>> I am against it because the way certain people are going about it
>>> subverts all democratic and constitutional norms / systems
>>> I am not interested in the least to be on any Govt body/post. My writings
>>> on this are purely a tactical move.
>>> Sarbajit
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 5:16 PM, Mathre Rangarajan <
rangajan@yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Dear Sarabjit,
>>>> What are you affraid of? Even if the Jan Lokpal Bill is drafted, do you
>>>> think Parliament will pass it? You are so venomous against all, just
>>>> because you were not made a member of this group? You have made amply clear
>>>> in various postings that you are more than qualified and should have been
>>>> included, but Government did not choose to and hance you have leashed this
>>>> anti compaign. ha! ha!
>>>>
>>>> From: Sarbajit Roy <
sroy.mb@gmail.com>
>>>> To:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com >>>> Sent: Monday, 13 June 2011 2:40 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] 3 POSITIVE points which Baba, Anna and IAC
>>>> will never ask for
>>>>
>>>> Dear Hemant
>>>>
>>>> Sometimes Individuals (acting as ninjas) can achieve more than crowds.
>>>> Take an example in my own case (because you asked in a previous email)
>>>>
>>>> I played a pivotal role in getting Mr Pramod Mahajan out of the Union
>>>> Cabinet when he was Telecom Minister. Because of this the Govt was able to
>>>> get about Rs. 3,000+ crores as revenue for licence violations (actually they
>>>> didnt have a licence in the first place - only the blessings of Ataljis
>>>> "family". I could only do this because there ARE honest babus - who need
>>>> fearless, honest & skilled citizens to do what they cant do themselves.
>>>>
>>>> Sarbajit
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 2:02 PM, Mr. Hemant Kshirsagar
>>>> <
hemantkshirsagar01@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> So that does not mean that we can ignore such good platforms for the
>>>> same.
>>>>
>>>> Do we as an individual have a power to collect such fan following???
>>>>
>>>> The least we can do is follow such people who create a movementum for
>>>> the same.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 1:52 PM, Sarbajit Roy <
sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Mr Rangarajan
>>>>
>>>> FIRST: The fear of God will not be put into dishonest public servants by
>>>> new laws or "old wine in new bottles"<he he>.
>>>>
>>>> SECOND: The existing laws are essentially decentralised into various
>>>> investigative agencies with some checks and balances. Now the fascist forces
>>>> want centralised laws / big brother / police + judge to be combined at one
>>>> point / grid.
>>>>
>>>> THIRD: All these people - Anna, Baba, Bhushan&Bhushan, Arvind, Hegde
>>>> are essentially COLLABORATORS who have all regularly taken Govt money at
>>>> some point in time for services rendered Such QUISLINGS are doing all this
>>>> drama knowing very well that "only the small fish will be caught while the
>>>> big operators will carry on"- (and can Mr Prasanth Bhushan deny that he made
>>>> this remark in a public place albeit privately?)
>>>>
>>>> Sarbajit
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 12:27 PM, Mathre Rangarajan <
rangajan@yahoo.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> M. Rangarajan,
>>>> (retired Group General Manager ONGC)
>>>> B 2 – 301, SRIRAM SPANDHANA,
>>>> Chellaghatta village,
>>>> Bangalore – 560037.
>>>> Phone: 25227955, mobile 9945091581
>>>> e-mail:
rangajan@yahoo.com /
rangajan@gmail.com >>>> Dated 13th June 2011
>>>> The following two statements in the below postings is quite interesting:
>>>>
>>>> First - "put the fear of God into dishonest public servants" - how do
>>>> you do it? It is very obvious that exixting laws have failed to do this and
>>>> everybody agrees without any exception. Do you expect our honourable M Ps
>>>> who are leaders in curruption (may be baring very very few) will ever pass a
>>>> law to end curruption? Not in my life time.
>>>>
>>>> Second - "NEGATIVE laws which will turn India into a POLICE STATE
>>>> controlled by fascist forces" - Why do you need any new law for this - the
>>>> existing laws are enough - Smt Indira Gandhi declared ememgency - Delhi
>>>> police brutally beat up innocent sleeping people - there are hundreds of
>>>> examples of such brutal action by state in the past in India.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> From: Dr. NC JAIN <
j_nc@hotmail.com>
>>>> To:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com >>>> Sent: Monday, 13 June 2011 11:20 AM
>>>> Subject: RE: [HumJanenge] 3 POSITIVE points which Baba, Anna and IAC
>>>> will never ask for
>>>>
>>>> Dear sir
>>>> I donot agree with you. You might recall an incident in history when
>>>> Pandits of India stated that Mohmad Gajnavi will not do anything to the
>>>> Somnath temple because, they have saved the temple with their Mantras&
>>>> Slokas. Everyone knows the result. Today, it is Kalyoug,where things have to
>>>> be snatched and not given. You have to fight for your right , no one is
>>>> going to donate it. In theses circumstances, it is appropriate to fuel the
>>>> fire for the second war of independence started by Jaiprakash Narain.The
>>>> war is to make Indians free.
>>>> Dr N C Jain
>>>> 13-6-11
>>>>
>>>> Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2011 01:30:10 +0530
>>>> Subject: [HumJanenge] 3 POSITIVE points which Baba, Anna and IAC will
>>>> never ask for
>>>> From:
sroy.mb@gmail.com >>>> To:
humjanenge@googlegroups.com >>>>
>>>> Baba, SrSri, Anna, Swami-A, Swami-S, GuruV, GuruM ....
>>>>
>>>> 3 small POSITIVE steps (followed in many progressive countries) is all
>>>> it takes to generate the momentum to reduce corruption to the point where it
>>>> will cease to affect the ordinary citizens (ie those who pay bribes for
>>>> daily services, school admissions, building sanctions etc), reduce
>>>> inflation, and put the fear of God into dishonest public servants.
>>>>
>>>> Why have all these Babas and Swamis not agitated for these POSITIVE
>>>> steps while instead only demanding NEGATIVE laws which will turn India into
>>>> a POLICE STATE controlled by fascist forces ?
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
