Saturday, December 22, 2012

Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

मेरा मन १६ तारीख से यह सोंच सोंच कर परेशान है की क्या भारत में यह पहला बलत्कार था ,
किस वजह से हिन्दुस्तान के सारे मीडिया ने इसे नैशनल मुद्दा बना दिया ???
यह प्रश्न मुझको तब से सोने नहीं दे रहा है...
और आज मीडिया इस मुद्दे को छोड़कर सचिन के गुण गायेगा...





With Regards
Alok Kumar Singh


मोबइल : +91-९९३६७१६५२६


On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 12:01 PM, Prem Sabhlok <psabhlok@hotmail.com> wrote:
Think globally act locally.
Human nature of a material man is by and large the same throughout the world. Over 99% are material men in the world.
It is the kind of government, systems and culture which make the difference.
 
Least corruption is in the countries where state and central govts concentrate on defence, Policing, law and order and quick justice. They do not waste time on producing watches, bread, scooters etc and also avoid leaking subsidies. Infact they do not dabble with business and trade. In India the basic functions like defence, policing, law and order, justice are weak- nearly non existant/abnoramally delayed justice/no fear of law. See abnormally large number of people jump traffic red lights.
 
2. In those countries local governmets are strong and effective. In India these are weak and ineffective and openly resort to corrupt practices.
 
3. Those countries do not have colonial model of Bureaucracy and 150 years old laws like India where 1860, 1861 Laws/Acts/Penal codes etc are still being followed. There is no concept of Divisional Commssioner/D.C/ District Collector/SDM/Tehsildar/Patwari etc in those countries. We are the only country where corrupt colonial model of bureaucracy continues even after over 6 decades of independence.
Our IAS officers have become harassing, unaccounatble, non transparent and openly flout the Constitution of India. For them their Constituion is verbal/unwritten orders of their political bosses.  
 
4. Least Corrupt countries make clear distinction between Independence and Freedom, we hardly know this difference. Independent countries like extremely powerful USSR break into smaller hostile states. India is steadily moving in that direction as central political parties are getting weaker and zonal/sectional/provincial perties are getting powerful. A great danger signal.
 
5. Least corrupt countries know that democracy and socialism can not go together. This combination is an open door for corruption and even mafia politics.
 
6. Least corrupt countries do not have lakhs of fake commercial spiritualists/ Babas, Swamis, Ammas etc who encourage corruption so that they can syphon off balck money of corrupt people. These fake spirtualis have built marble palaces, have personal aircrafts out of black money of their disciples.
 
Prem Sabhlok 
 
Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2012 10:14:04 +0530
From: achawla42@gmail.com
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
CC: krisdev@gmail.com

Subject: Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

Human beings are corrupt by nature. We,therefore can not eradicate corruption unless and until our minds are trained against such acts though education, training and fear of heavy punishment.
Unfortunately with the spread of secularism which wrongly has been considered as Non religion, we have lost the fear of almighty as well.

Avinash Chawla  

On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 12:31 AM, Punita Verma <p.verma.du@gmail.com> wrote:
I agree too. Actually the mahabharat is always within where the five good senses(pandavas) guided by God have to win over 100 evil inclinations (kauravas). The mahabharat can be won only with righteousness from within.

On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 11:13 PM, krisdev@gmail.com <krisdev@gmail.com> wrote:

Totally agree with Sarbajit. This is a mute point for self introspection. If we touch our heart most of us (includes me) if not all of us are corrupt in some way or other and a hypocrite in some way or other. The change should begin with each one of us. It should be a mix of voluntary by self and forced by a transparent system where no one should try to cheat anyone or the system and never get away with it. Honesty should become the hallmark of society. It should become a way of life and revered by all.

Best. Kris Dev.

-----Original Message-----
From: Sarbajit Roy
Sent:  22/12/2012 10:31:59 pm
Subject:  Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

Dear Dr. Chaturvedi,

There is of course only 1 scientific (Vedic) answer to your query. And it
is very short and direct.

Ans: "We" are corrupt because "I" am corrupt AND because "You" are also
corrupt.

Corollary : If even 1 of us is NOT corrupt than "We" can never be corrupt.

I hope this answers your query satisfactorily.

Sarbajit



On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 9:05 PM, Dr. Sanjay Chaturvedi <
drsanjaychaturvedi@gmail.com> wrote:

> So many reply but none clearly say " why are we corrupt?" So much
> confusion - can such a big group who claims to be rising - treating only
> symptom - and not the cause.
>
> Sanjay
> 1/188 Delhi Gate, Agra 9412261575
> ------------------------------
>
>




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Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC++] DEMAND -- REMOVE VIP SECURITY & GIVE TO PEOPLE

Warning: Unparliamentary language follows.

================================
Are we decided that this group is a permanent pissing contest? In which case, it doesn't make sense to invest time.

If we are serious about this being a space to fight corruption and engineer better accountability and transparency, then the urgent need RIGHT NOW is to stop sneering and baiting and overall trying to prove who is the bigger dick. Get to work, whoever is the genius will get noticed.

Or start a thread for "My halo is bigger than yours" and put all the crap there so people not interested can forward it to trash.

I agree there are many great patriots and veterans and all kinds of creative and useful people here, but we need to get over the school hangup that there can be only one great and credible person in a given space.

I thank you for bringing in all your special strengths and hope we can use them to kick the butt of corruption instead of deciding who is greater *before* doing anything.

Vidyut
PS: I am female. So avoid the Mr.Vidyut replies.
Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC++] No justification for Relaxation in Selection Criteria.

To,

Hon'ble Shri. Waghela

You may please refer the following on question of merit and decision of IIT kharagpur which you have mentioned in your email.

Article 16 of the Constitution of India reads as under:-

16. (1) There shall be equality of opportunity for all citizens in matters relating to employment or appointment to any office under the State.

(2) No citizen shall, on grounds only of religion, race,caste, sex, descent, place of birth, residence or any of them, be ineligible for, or discriminated against in respect of, any employment or office under the State.

(3) Nothing in this article shall prevent Parliament from making any law prescribing, in regard to a class or classes of employment or appointment to an office 1[under the Government of, or any local or other authority within, a State or Union territory, any requirement as to residence within that State or Union territory] prior to such employment or appointment.

(4) Nothing in this article shall prevent the State from making any provision for the reservation of appointments or posts in favour of any backward class of citizens which, in the opinion of the State, is not adequately represented in the services under the State.

2[(4A) Nothing in this article shall prevent the State from making any provision for reservation 3[in matters of promotion, with consequential seniority, to any class] or classes of posts in the services under the State in favour of the Scheduled Castes and the Scheduled Tribes which, in the opinion of the State, are not adequately represented in the services under the State.]

4[(4B) Nothing in this article shall prevent the State from considering any unfilled vacancies of a year which are reserved for being filled up in that year in accordance with any provision for reservation made under clause (4) or clause (4A) as a separate class of vacancies to be filled up in any succeeding year or years and such class of vacancies shall not be considered together with the vacancies of the year in which they are being filled up for determining the ceiling of fifty per cent. reservation on total number of vacancies of that year.]

(5) Nothing in this article shall affect the operation of any law which provides that the incumbent of an office in connection with the affairs of any religious or denominational institution or any member of the governing body thereof shall be a person professing a particular religion or belonging to a particular denomination.

You may also refer Article 335 of the Constitution of India which reads as under:-

335. The claims of the members of the Scheduled Castes and the Scheduled Tribes shall be taken into consideration, consistently with the maintenance of efficiency of administration, in the making of appointments to services and posts in connection with the affairs of the Union or of a State:

1[Provided that nothing in this article shall prevent in making of any provision in favour of the members of the Scheduled Castes and the Scheduled Tribes for relaxation in qualifying marks in any examination or lowering the standards of evaluation, for reservation in matters of promotion to any class or classes of services or posts in connection with the affairs of the Union or of a State.]

Please read the judgment of Supreme Court in M Nagaraj and others Vs Union of India

""CONCLUSION:

The impugned constitutional amendments by which Articles 16(4A) and 16(4B) have been inserted flow from Article 16(4). They do not alter the structure of Article 16(4). They retain the controlling factors or the compelling reasons, namely, backwardness and inadequacy of representation which enables the States to provide for reservation keeping in mind the overall

efficiency of the State administration under Article 335.These impugned amendments are confined only to SCs and STs. They do not obliterate any of the constitutional requirements, namely, ceiling-limit of 50% (quantitative limitation), the concept of creamy layer (qualitative exclusion), the sub-classification between OBC on one hand and SCs and STs on the other hand as held in Indra Sawhney5 , the concept of post-based Roster with in-built concept of replacement as held in R.K. Sabharwal8.

We reiterate that the ceiling-limit of 50%, the concept of creamy layer and the compelling reasons, namely, backwardness, inadequacy of representation and overall administrative efficiency are all constitutional requirements without which the structure of equality of opportunity in Article 16 would collapse.

However, in this case, as stated, the main issue concerns the "extent of reservation". In this regard the concerned State will have to show in each case the existence of the compelling reasons, namely, backwardness, inadequacy of representation and overall administrative efficiency before making provision for reservation. As stated above, the impugned provision is an enabling provision. The State is not bound to make reservation for SC/ST in matter of promotions. However if they wish to exercise their discretion and make such provision, the State has to collect quantifiable data showing backwardness of the class and inadequacy of representation of that class in public employment in addition to compliance of Article 335. It is made clear that even if the State has compelling reasons, as stated above, the State will have to see that its reservation provision does not lead to excessiveness so as to breach the ceiling-limit of 50% or obliterate the creamy layer or extend the reservation indefinitely.

Subject to above, we uphold the constitutional validity of the Constitution (Seventy-Seventh

Amendment) Act, 1995, the Constitution (Eighty-First Amendment) Act, 2000, the Constitution (Eighty-Second Amendment) Act, 2000 and the Constitution (Eighty-Fifth Amendment) Act, 2001.

We have not examined the validity of individual enactments of appropriate States and that question will be gone into in individual writ petition by the appropriate bench in accordance with law laid down by us in the present case.

Reference is answered accordingly.""

The similar criterion is given under Article 29(2) and therefore not only there is reservation for SC/St students but as per law there will relaxation in marks and percentage of marks.

I personally feel that IIT is in limited sense although state but it is also bound by constitution and cannot ignore law of Parliament.

Therefore the order passed by IIT is unconstitutional if some challenge it before SCI and SCI will declare the order as unconstitutional.

There are few questions which are as follows

A) How to define compelling reasons.

B)What is the exact meaning of the word "backward"?Whether the Backward means economically backward or socially backward? Or both?

The most important question which arouses is that whether Parliament or Government can create a caste and answer is negative.

Dr. Babasaheb Ambedkar adopted "Bouddh" religion by denouncing Hindu religion it means that he has adopted Bouddh religion unconditionally and he was not allowed to take his caste when he left Hindu religion. He was not allowed to create a new caste in the religion in which he was new.

There were thousand of peoples who denounced Hindu religion and adopted Bouddh religion along with Dr. Ambedkar. I found that there wards were not entitled to benefits of reservation after conversion to Bouddh religion but still till date they are using their old caste although they are on one hand saying they are bouddh and on other hand using their old for getting the benefits of reservation. They are adopting double standards and such peoples must restrain to use old caste benefits should not be extended to them.

 



viadya

--- On Sat, 22/12/12, Babubhai Vaghela <vaghelabd@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Babubhai Vaghela <vaghelabd@yahoo.com>
Subject: [IAC++] No justification for Relaxation in Selection Criteria.
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Date: Saturday, 22 December, 2012, 8:56 AM

Dear All,

I, for one, is dead against the Relaxation in the Selection Criteria whether for School / College Admission or for Employee Recruitment or for Promotion - that is based on Caste consideration.

We the People must demand that long overdue change in the larger public interest. 

Reference:
Welcome change in the Admission Criteria for MMST 2010 by IIT Kharagpur - "No Relaxation" in Percentage of Marks for Any Category of Candidate... https://t.co/qaOabGfs

With warm regards,

--
(Babubhai Vaghela)
C 202, Shrinandnagar V, Makarba Road Vejalpur, 
(Administrator - Google Group - Right to Information Act 2005)

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

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Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC++] Fw: Re: Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause

If all rapes are reported by media- Delhi itself reporting 2 rape cases a day, you will have a newspaper page full of rape cases and another page of crimes like molestation, murders or robberies.
 
Moral education at primary levels and attention and educating the child by motehrs is important in moulding the character of the child.
 
The Delhi rape was by slum dwellers after heavy drinking in an inebriated state.
 
Most of the Ministers and MP-s /Politicians will be reminded of their actions of rapes or illegal sex with girls coming for favours like jobs..etc.

From: AK Bhattacharyya <ajitkbhattacharyya@yahoo.com>
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 10:23 AM
Subject: Re: [IAC++] Fw: Re: Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause
Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

Dear Naveen

Thank you for remembering me. Your recollection of that matter is
considerably at variance with reality so let me update you, also since
I understand you are with the NAPM who have a small RTI movement in UP
also.

1) I did not "lose" along with the CIC. I "won" along with the DDA.

2) The issues before the Court were

A) If CIC could frame Regulations for RTI.
I and the DDA said they could not. Both of us submitted our written
statements to this effect. The CIC had no answer and did not file any
written submissions.

B) If DDA had an obligation to disclose information suo-moto under section 4
This was my issue, and it was emphatically answered in my favour

C) If CIC could form a committee of enquiry of outsiders u/s 18.
Both DDA and I said they could not.Both of us submitted our written
statements to this effect. The CIC had no answer and did not file any
written submissions.

You can read the detailed judgement on DHC website (WP(C)12714/2009.
Nothing to show that I "lost".

The matter is now in Supreme Court as a Civil Appeal brought by the
CIC. Although on "theoretical" grounds I would have preferred to side
with the DDA and hammer the CIC, on practical grounds seeing the poor
state of RTI in the country I am not entering appearance in the matter
to give the hapless CIC a fair shot.

Sarbajit
National Convenor
India Against Corruption, Jan Andolan

On 12/23/12, Naveen Tewari <nct.lko@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Sarabjit,
>
> Just wanted to know if you are the same person who filed a petition against
> DDA which was eventually lost by you and CIC in the Delhi High Court? Did
> you file an appeal against that judgement?
>
> Regards
>
> Naveen Tewari
> Lucknow
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On २२-१२-२०१२, at ११:४७ अपराह्न, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dear Dr Chaturvedi
>>
>> You and I are corrupt because we were a part of God (Brahman) and need to
>> be again renewed with God.
>>
>> Sarbajit
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 11:07 PM, Dr. Sanjay Chaturvedi
>> <drsanjaychaturvedi@gmail.com> wrote:
>> You mean that we are corrupt because I and you are corrupt than why I and
>> you are corrupt any vedic answer?
>> 1/188 Delhi Gate, Agra 9412261575
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com>
>> Sender: iac-request@lists.riseup.net
>> Date: Sat, 22 Dec 2012 22:31:59
>> To: iac<iac@lists.riseup.net>
>> Reply-To: iac@lists.riseup.net
>> Subject: Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters
>>
>> WWW : http://indiaagainstcorruption.net.in
>> Post: iac@lists.riseup.net
>> Quit: iac-unsubscribe@lists.riseup.net
>> Help: http://help.riseup.net/lists/
>>
>>
>> WWW : http://indiaagainstcorruption.net.in
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>>
>>
>>
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>
Posted by at No comments:

RE: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

Think globally act locally.
Human nature of a material man is by and large the same throughout the world. Over 99% are material men in the world.
It is the kind of government, systems and culture which make the difference.
 
Least corruption is in the countries where state and central govts concentrate on defence, Policing, law and order and quick justice. They do not waste time on producing watches, bread, scooters etc and also avoid leaking subsidies. Infact they do not dabble with business and trade. In India the basic functions like defence, policing, law and order, justice are weak- nearly non existant/abnoramally delayed justice/no fear of law. See abnormally large number of people jump traffic red lights.
 
2. In those countries local governmets are strong and effective. In India these are weak and ineffective and openly resort to corrupt practices.
 
3. Those countries do not have colonial model of Bureaucracy and 150 years old laws like India where 1860, 1861 Laws/Acts/Penal codes etc are still being followed. There is no concept of Divisional Commssioner/D.C/ District Collector/SDM/Tehsildar/Patwari etc in those countries. We are the only country where corrupt colonial model of bureaucracy continues even after over 6 decades of independence.
Our IAS officers have become harassing, unaccounatble, non transparent and openly flout the Constitution of India. For them their Constituion is verbal/unwritten orders of their political bosses.  
 
4. Least Corrupt countries make clear distinction between Independence and Freedom, we hardly know this difference. Independent countries like extremely powerful USSR break into smaller hostile states. India is steadily moving in that direction as central political parties are getting weaker and zonal/sectional/provincial perties are getting powerful. A great danger signal.
 
5. Least corrupt countries know that democracy and socialism can not go together. This combination is an open door for corruption and even mafia politics.
 
6. Least corrupt countries do not have lakhs of fake commercial spiritualists/ Babas, Swamis, Ammas etc who encourage corruption so that they can syphon off balck money of corrupt people. These fake spirtualis have built marble palaces, have personal aircrafts out of black money of their disciples.
 
Prem Sabhlok 
 
Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2012 10:14:04 +0530
From: achawla42@gmail.com
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
CC: krisdev@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

Human beings are corrupt by nature. We,therefore can not eradicate corruption unless and until our minds are trained against such acts though education, training and fear of heavy punishment.
Unfortunately with the spread of secularism which wrongly has been considered as Non religion, we have lost the fear of almighty as well.

Avinash Chawla  

On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 12:31 AM, Punita Verma <p.verma.du@gmail.com> wrote:
I agree too. Actually the mahabharat is always within where the five good senses(pandavas) guided by God have to win over 100 evil inclinations (kauravas). The mahabharat can be won only with righteousness from within.

On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 11:13 PM, krisdev@gmail.com <krisdev@gmail.com> wrote:

Totally agree with Sarbajit. This is a mute point for self introspection. If we touch our heart most of us (includes me) if not all of us are corrupt in some way or other and a hypocrite in some way or other. The change should begin with each one of us. It should be a mix of voluntary by self and forced by a transparent system where no one should try to cheat anyone or the system and never get away with it. Honesty should become the hallmark of society. It should become a way of life and revered by all.

Best. Kris Dev.

-----Original Message-----
From: Sarbajit Roy
Sent:  22/12/2012 10:31:59 pm
Subject:  Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

Dear Dr. Chaturvedi,

There is of course only 1 scientific (Vedic) answer to your query. And it
is very short and direct.

Ans: "We" are corrupt because "I" am corrupt AND because "You" are also
corrupt.

Corollary : If even 1 of us is NOT corrupt than "We" can never be corrupt.

I hope this answers your query satisfactorily.

Sarbajit


On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 9:05 PM, Dr. Sanjay Chaturvedi <
drsanjaychaturvedi@gmail.com> wrote:

> So many reply but none clearly say " why are we corrupt?" So much
> confusion - can such a big group who claims to be rising - treating only
> symptom - and not the cause.
>
> Sanjay
> 1/188 Delhi Gate, Agra 9412261575
> ------------------------------
>
>


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Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC++] Rape - Need for strong measures now

This dramatisation should stop now.....

On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 4:53 AM, J Raman <events@southasianoutlook.com> wrote:
This is not the first time and the last time that a minor girl or a major girl has been raped.

Over the years, there have been cases of step-fathers / uncles / grand fathers raping the ones who trust them the most.

If that has happened over the generations, how can this be stopped.

Currently the media is reporting about the outrage over the gang-rape of a girl in a public bus but wonder how long will it last... till perhaps something else newsy turns up and perhaps until the next such or worst happens.

With political parties trying to garner public sympathy (and perhaps votes in the next election), they have over the years acted like Gandhi's three monkeys when it comes to fielding their candidates.

Here is a report that has been circulated and reported even in international media (Pakistan included):

HYPOCRITES: Political Parties Field Rapists in Elections | India ...
http://www.indiatimes.com/india/hypocrites-political-parties-field-rapists-in-elections-51044.html

One can't expect anything from the current crop of politicians but words meant for media-bites only.

There is need for URGENT and STRONG ACTION NOW. All those have sisters and wives (and were born out of women) MUST

- FORCE the political parties to drop any candidates who have been convicted or accused of rape and sexual assaults,
- ENSURE that rape and assault cases are fast-tracked in special courts to be set up NOW,
- RECALL the parliament NOW without waiting for the next session,
- PASS strong laws with unanimous vote to try and punish those accused of rape and sexual assault,
- FIND a way to protect the women from being 'raped' and 'assaulted' in the court with lawyers out there to defend their clients even though they know the real facts,
- SHIFT the onus on the accused to prove their innocence.

Before the next election, all parties should vet the aspirants for ticket before they become candidates.

The public, in general, and organisations like IAC, in particular, can come up with other ideas which can be passed on to their MPs and RS members.

J Raman

-----Original Message----- From: krisdev@gmail.com
Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2012 12:53 PM
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Subject: RE: [IAC++] Now 3 yr old girl raped in Delhi school

It's not just rape of a girl, it's rape of a society by the corrupt, the wily, the drunkard, the drug addict, the scoundrel, the cheat, the infidel, etc, etc. It's the accumulation of the sins of society over generations and our silent tolerance of wrongs committed and atrocities tolerated.

Kris Dev.


-----Original Message-----
From: Subba Rao N
Sent:  22/12/2012 3:41:56 pm
Subject:  Re: [IAC++] Now 3 yr old girl raped in Delhi school

one more worse crime and shame! Oh,my God...what is happening to my country?
subbarao

On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 2:00 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:


http://www.firstpost.com/india/now-a-three-year-old-girl-raped-in-west-delhi-play-school-566248.html
 <http://www.firstpost.com/author/hidden>
Dec 22, 2012 <http://www.firstpost.com/author/hidden>
<http://www.firstpost.com/author/hidden>
<http://www.firstpost.com/author/hidden>

*New Delhi:* A three-year-old girl was raped in a play-school in West
Delhi, prompting the Delhi government to  ask the police to take stringent
action against its principal.

The child was allegedly raped by the husband of the owner of the school on
Monday in west Delhi's Sagarpur area, and the incident came to light two
days later, police said.

After the incident, the victim got ill and her family members admitted her
in a hospital where doctors informed them that she has been raped.


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Posted by at No comments:

[IAC++] Delhi HC rejected challenge to vires of Sections 8(1)(d) and 8(1)(e) of RTI Act.

Dear All,

On 21st November 2012 Delhi High Court rejected challenge to the vires of Sections 8(1)(d) and 8(1)(e) of RTI Act.

This judgment has far reaching impact in the matter of disclosure when "Public Interest" is to be weighed. http://lobis.nic.in/dhc/RSE/judgement/23-11-2012/RSE21112012CW72482012.pdf

Google Doc  - https://t.co/XYGWAJtf

Whether Reliance Industries Limited move Supreme Court or not remains to be seen.

Regards,

--
(Babubhai Vaghela)
C 202, Shrinandnagar V, Makarba Road Vejalpur, 
(Administrator - Google Group - Right to Information Act 2005)
Posted by at No comments:

[IAC++] What Needs to be Done about Growing Rapes in India - PLEASE POST

This is not the first time and the last time that a minor girl or a major
girl has been raped.

Over the years, there have been cases of step-fathers / uncles / grand
fathers, coming from different classes and religions in different countries, raping the ones who trust them the most.

If that has happened over the generations, how can this be stopped.

Currently the media is reporting about the outrage over the gang-rape of a
girl in a public bus but wonder how long will it last... till perhaps
something else newsy turns up and perhaps until the next such or worst
happens.

With political parties trying to garner public sympathy (and perhaps votes
in the next election), they have over the years acted like Gandhi's three
monkeys when it comes to fielding their candidates.

Here is a report that has been circulated and reported even in international
media (Pakistan included):

HYPOCRITES: Political Parties Field Rapists in Elections

 


One can't expect anything from the current crop of politicians but words
meant for media-bites only.

There is need for URGENT and STRONG ACTION NOW. All those men (born out of women) have sisters and wives MUST

- FORCE the political parties to drop any candidates who have been convicted
or accused of rape and sexual assaults,
- ENSURE that rape and assault cases are fast-tracked in special courts to
be set up NOW,
- RECALL the parliament NOW without waiting for the next session,
- PASS strong laws with unanimous vote to try and punish those accused of
rape and sexual assault,
- FIND a way to protect the women from being 'raped' and 'assaulted' in the
court with lawyers out there to defend their clients even though they know
the real facts,
- SHIFT the onus on the accused to prove their innocence.

Before the next election, all parties should vet the aspirants for ticket
before they become candidates.

The public, in general, and organisations, in particular, can come
up with other ideas which can be passed on to their MPs and Rajya Sabha  members.

Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

If we change the world will change.Let us start from ouirselves.
Dr Narendra Deo

On 23 December 2012 00:31, Punita Verma <p.verma.du@gmail.com> wrote:
I agree too. Actually the mahabharat is always within where the five good senses(pandavas) guided by God have to win over 100 evil inclinations (kauravas). The mahabharat can be won only with righteousness from within.

On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 11:13 PM, krisdev@gmail.com <krisdev@gmail.com> wrote:

Totally agree with Sarbajit. This is a mute point for self introspection. If we touch our heart most of us (includes me) if not all of us are corrupt in some way or other and a hypocrite in some way or other. The change should begin with each one of us. It should be a mix of voluntary by self and forced by a transparent system where no one should try to cheat anyone or the system and never get away with it. Honesty should become the hallmark of society. It should become a way of life and revered by all.

Best. Kris Dev.

-----Original Message-----
From: Sarbajit Roy
Sent:  22/12/2012 10:31:59 pm
Subject:  Re: [IAC++] enlighten us all those who matters

Dear Dr. Chaturvedi,

There is of course only 1 scientific (Vedic) answer to your query. And it
is very short and direct.

Ans: "We" are corrupt because "I" am corrupt AND because "You" are also
corrupt.

Corollary : If even 1 of us is NOT corrupt than "We" can never be corrupt.

I hope this answers your query satisfactorily.

Sarbajit


On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 9:05 PM, Dr. Sanjay Chaturvedi <
drsanjaychaturvedi@gmail.com> wrote:

> So many reply but none clearly say " why are we corrupt?" So much
> confusion - can such a big group who claims to be rising - treating only
> symptom - and not the cause.
>
> Sanjay
> 1/188 Delhi Gate, Agra 9412261575
> ------------------------------
>
>


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SeniorRepresentativeYugNirmanMissionGyatri Pariwar HQ"ShantiKunj"(UK)
LifeMember OF-    TI India,              BHAVANA Lucknow.
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Posted by at No comments:

[IAC++] "MPs owe crores to NDMC, MTNL".

Dear All,

"MPs owe crores to NDMC, MTNL"

Let Govt recover it from the salary of Chairman MTNL / Chairperson NDMC, responsible to recover, if they can't recover long overdue from the so called "Honourable". 

Reference Message to PG PMO - https://t.co/mDGjaqsW

Regards,

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(Administrator - Google Group - Right to Information Act 2005)
Posted by at No comments:

Re: [IAC++] Fw: Re: Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause

Systemic missionary action is needed to reduce this crime on humanity.Sporadic action is not enough to mark a lasting effect.

With kind regards



A.K.BHATTACHARYYA

F.I.StructE (UK), FIE (India), FIBE, FIRT
H-2A, Hauzkhas, New Delhi -16, Ph:011-26854127

--- On Fri, 12/21/12, Lata P.M. <latapm@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Lata P.M. <latapm@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [IAC++] Fw: Re: Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Cc: "rimi tadu" <rimitadu@gmail.com>
Date: Friday, December 21, 2012, 10:14 AM

 To, Mr, Venkatraman,
  As you quoted an incident of blind man's wife with your last paragraph that it is necessary for women to be more careful and dress themselves with dignity and avoid "free life" in the name of modern lifestyle. I just wanted to know man that do you think blind man's wife was not carefully dressed up and so was molested or raped?
Or molesters, rapists were provoked by other women wearings and raped a wife of blind man?
Do you think there should be civilized full dressing for men and women but I have seen so many men only on half pant roaming in my country piecing everywhere out on the roads is there any incident of male raped happened  just because they move without clothes?
 The sensitive person should at least understand act like rape or molestation is shameful , heinous crime whether it would be on women, male children, rich or  poor, housewife or working, dalit, adivasi, deprived, minority, majority or from any caste or any profession. And all such reports should immediately be reported in media. the raped one's name should not be disclosed and the all guilty's should be arrested. your cry for deprived poor woman will be strengthen if you will not take a position of moral policing. do you know in India from  3 month's girl to 80 years old woman are raped. Even by their family members like father, uncle, brothers happened to be rapists. Do you think this because of their dress sense their family members were provoked  Don't you think that indirectly you are justifying rapists's act and providing them such fake baseless argument on the name of values.
Was Draupadi having natural and economic freedom when she was molested, when Mathura one Adivasi woman was raped by police men were they enjoying their economic and uniform power or Mathura as agriculture labour was enjoying her economic freedom?
 If you want to protect rapist save them openly, we as women from India we know there are very few men who will come forward without biases, but they are sanskriti holders, like pandava and kaurava.. they have to carry the tradition of rape and watching and justifying rape.. you know only one man came forward to save Draupadi and all of us made  him  God just because others present there were not having humanity and anguish. It's very easy to be moral police but what are the morals for viewers? Why don't you remember you as a human being when you comment or criticize on such incidents, why suddenly you realize that you are man and Indian man and you have right to talk on woman's dress, wearings and corner them instead of showing support to the raped women and protest against rapist.
Rape is  heinous crime, stand against violence against women.
Lata P.M.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You are right sir.
Let us live with and according to the times.
It is natural that with rising economic freedom and education, women will rightly enjoy greater freedom.
I will drink to that.
Victor


--- On Wed, 12/19/12, Purobi Ghosh Mohan <cgsi09@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Purobi Ghosh Mohan <cgsi09@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [IAC++] Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Date: Wednesday, December 19, 2012, 9:46 PM

Dear Venkataraman,

I strongly object to your so called 'moral policing' of women. Lack of values are not based on genders. They are values propagated by parents and the environment.

Let's work towards making the environment 'livable', the rest will take care of itself.

Regards

Purobi Ghosh Mohan
On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 8:39 PM, Venkatraman Ns <nsvenkatchennai@gmail.com> wrote:
N.S.Venkataraman,
Trustee,
Nandini Voice for the Deprived,
Chennai

To,
India Against Corruption



Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause

The disgusting incident of rape in Delhi is nothing new in today's India, though the media has given wide publicity to this incident. Many such incidents have been taking place all over the country, more so amongst the women in the lower income group and many such incidents have not been reported.
 
Sometime back, a blind man's wife, ( who has vision ) was escorting her child from the school at 4 pm in the evening in suburb of Chennai, when four rowdies pushed her into a corner and assaulted her. Her blind husband anxious that the wife has not returned, took the help of some friends and went in search of her. He found her lying in a corner in a field totally devastated with the child crying nearby. This matter was reported in some local papers and a FIR was registered. To cut the long story short, the culprits were identified but they have gone scot-free. Obviously, those with political clout or money power can get away with any crime in today's India. The rapidly increasing widespread drinking habit is a major reason for such incidents taking place. Gandhijis advocacy of prohibition has fallen on dead ears. One wonders whether those in charge of administration who know these things have any conscience at all.
 
Due to the prevailing climate, number of rowdies in the country are increasing every day and police force are becoming increasingly inefficient and disinterested and the politicians in power have no sense of responsibility. The media including print and visual media as well as journals and cinemas, are also responsible for such a situation, as they highlight such incidents viewing them as  sensational news and  business opportunity, while ignoring several good things that are happening.
 
The corrupt conditions and excessive greediness to make money at any cost are creating such conditions where the law breakers have no fear of law and they think they can buy anyone.What is particularly sad is that the judiciary is also playing a role in promoting such a climate of violence, by not giving judgements in quick time and permitting the offenders to exploit the loopholes in law in the name of protecting the individual rights. Hundreds of cases can be shown where criminals and rapists have gone scot free.
 
Now women are the victims more in the rural areas and small towns.
 
It also causes concern that women too are contributing to such conditions by their mode of dress, tendency to go with strangers or the so called boy friends even in the dark hours and lack of parental control. In Chennai city last week, 7 college girl students were reported to have gone for a ride at 11 pm in the night in a car without the knowledge of the parents and they rushed back home by 4 in the morning to reach home before the parents would know. The speeding car met with an accident in which one girl died and the others were injured.
 
It is necessary for women to be more careful and dress themselves with dignity and avoid "free life" in the name of modern lifestyle. Of course, the media would call the suggestion as moral policing and conduct another debate !



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--
Lata Pratibha Madhukar-(Lata P.M.)Social Activist, Researcher, Trainer and Writer-
India
91 9922320338
latapm@gmail.com''Ek pathar to tabiyat se uchhalo yaro kaun kaheta akash men surakh nahi ho sakta"------------Dushyantkumar
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Systemic missionary action is needed to reduce this crime on humanity.Sporadic action is not enough to mark a lasting effect.

With kind regards



A.K.BHATTACHARYYA

F.I.StructE (UK), FIE (India), FIBE, FIRT
H-2A, Hauzkhas, New Delhi -16, Ph:011-26854127

--- On Fri, 12/21/12, Lata P.M. <latapm@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Lata P.M. <latapm@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [IAC++] Fw: Re: Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Cc: "rimi tadu" <rimitadu@gmail.com>
Date: Friday, December 21, 2012, 10:14 AM

 To, Mr, Venkatraman,
  As you quoted an incident of blind man's wife with your last paragraph that it is necessary for women to be more careful and dress themselves with dignity and avoid "free life" in the name of modern lifestyle. I just wanted to know man that do you think blind man's wife was not carefully dressed up and so was molested or raped?
Or molesters, rapists were provoked by other women wearings and raped a wife of blind man?
Do you think there should be civilized full dressing for men and women but I have seen so many men only on half pant roaming in my country piecing everywhere out on the roads is there any incident of male raped happened  just because they move without clothes?
 The sensitive person should at least understand act like rape or molestation is shameful , heinous crime whether it would be on women, male children, rich or  poor, housewife or working, dalit, adivasi, deprived, minority, majority or from any caste or any profession. And all such reports should immediately be reported in media. the raped one's name should not be disclosed and the all guilty's should be arrested. your cry for deprived poor woman will be strengthen if you will not take a position of moral policing. do you know in India from  3 month's girl to 80 years old woman are raped. Even by their family members like father, uncle, brothers happened to be rapists. Do you think this because of their dress sense their family members were provoked  Don't you think that indirectly you are justifying rapists's act and providing them such fake baseless argument on the name of values.
Was Draupadi having natural and economic freedom when she was molested, when Mathura one Adivasi woman was raped by police men were they enjoying their economic and uniform power or Mathura as agriculture labour was enjoying her economic freedom?
 If you want to protect rapist save them openly, we as women from India we know there are very few men who will come forward without biases, but they are sanskriti holders, like pandava and kaurava.. they have to carry the tradition of rape and watching and justifying rape.. you know only one man came forward to save Draupadi and all of us made  him  God just because others present there were not having humanity and anguish. It's very easy to be moral police but what are the morals for viewers? Why don't you remember you as a human being when you comment or criticize on such incidents, why suddenly you realize that you are man and Indian man and you have right to talk on woman's dress, wearings and corner them instead of showing support to the raped women and protest against rapist.
Rape is  heinous crime, stand against violence against women.
Lata P.M.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You are right sir.
Let us live with and according to the times.
It is natural that with rising economic freedom and education, women will rightly enjoy greater freedom.
I will drink to that.

Victor


--- On Wed, 12/19/12, Purobi Ghosh Mohan <cgsi09@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Purobi Ghosh Mohan <cgsi09@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [IAC++] Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Date: Wednesday, December 19, 2012, 9:46 PM

Dear Venkataraman,

I strongly object to your so called 'moral policing' of women. Lack of values are not based on genders. They are values propagated by parents and the environment.

Let's work towards making the environment 'livable', the rest will take care of itself.

Regards

Purobi Ghosh Mohan


On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 8:39 PM, Venkatraman Ns <nsvenkatchennai@gmail.com> wrote:

N.S.Venkataraman,

Trustee,

Nandini Voice for the Deprived,

Chennai


To,

India Against Corruption




Rape in Delhi – All round corruption and lack of values could be the cause


The disgusting incident of rape in Delhi is nothing new in today's India, though the media has given wide publicity to this incident. Many such incidents have been taking place all over the country, more so amongst the women in the lower income group and many such incidents have not been reported.

 

Sometime back, a blind man's wife, ( who has vision ) was escorting her child from the school at 4 pm in the evening in suburb of Chennai, when four rowdies pushed her into a corner and assaulted her. Her blind husband anxious that the wife has not returned, took the help of some friends and went in search of her. He found her lying in a corner in a field totally devastated with the child crying nearby. This matter was reported in some local papers and a FIR was registered. To cut the long story short, the culprits were identified but they have gone scot-free. Obviously, those with political clout or money power can get away with any crime in today's India. The rapidly increasing widespread drinking habit is a major reason for such incidents taking place. Gandhijis advocacy of prohibition has fallen on dead ears. One wonders whether those in charge of administration who know these things have any conscience at all.

 

Due to the prevailing climate, number of rowdies in the country are increasing every day and police force are becoming increasingly inefficient and disinterested and the politicians in power have no sense of responsibility. The media including print and visual media as well as journals and cinemas, are also responsible for such a situation, as they highlight such incidents viewing them as  sensational news and  business opportunity, while ignoring several good things that are happening.

 

The corrupt conditions and excessive greediness to make money at any cost are creating such conditions where the law breakers have no fear of law and they think they can buy anyone.What is particularly sad is that the judiciary is also playing a role in promoting such a climate of violence, by not giving judgements in quick time and permitting the offenders to exploit the loopholes in law in the name of protecting the individual rights. Hundreds of cases can be shown where criminals and rapists have gone scot free.

 

Now women are the victims more in the rural areas and small towns.

 

It also causes concern that women too are contributing to such conditions by their mode of dress, tendency to go with strangers or the so called boy friends even in the dark hours and lack of parental control. In Chennai city last week, 7 college girl students were reported to have gone for a ride at 11 pm in the night in a car without the knowledge of the parents and they rushed back home by 4 in the morning to reach home before the parents would know. The speeding car met with an accident in which one girl died and the others were injured.

 

It is necessary for women to be more careful and dress themselves with dignity and avoid "free life" in the name of modern lifestyle. Of course, the media would call the suggestion as moral policing and conduct another debate !


N.S.Venkataraman

Trustee

Nandini Voice for the Deprived

Chennai

Email: nsvenkatchennai@gmail.com

WWW : http://indiaagainstcorruption.net.in
Post: iac@lists.riseup.net
Quit: iac-unsubscribe@lists.riseup.net
Help: http://help.riseup.net/lists/



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--
Lata Pratibha Madhukar-(Lata P.M.)
Social Activist, Researcher, Trainer and Writer-
India
91 9922320338
latapm@gmail.com


''Ek pathar to tabiyat se uchhalo yaro kaun kaheta akash men surakh nahi ho sakta"------------Dushyantkumar

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