Re: [HumJanenge] Warning to Member [P.M Ravindran]

Sir

I have not understood most of what you have written, especially the
management jargon. . Neither can I agree with you that people and
processes can be taken to act like sprites in a computer simulation /
action-plan / mission mode. All your plans and tactics are like those
used by our opposition. We are irregulars, we believe in guerilla
tactics, hit and run, and fight conventional fixed battles (ie legal
cases) only when we are very sure of victory (and after deep
preparation).

There is no wasteful discussion in this group. The list owners have
vast experience in managing RTI groups. We are carefully monitoring
and controlling the dynamic process here. I can safely say that these
are the most efficient RTI groups now in existence, and are getting
more efficient with the passage of time. We are also lucky to have the
aid and assistance of a very senior ex-IPS and some very senior IAS to
guide us.

We (the group) are like a still lake (or iceberg). The real action is
going on underwater
and bears little correlation to what is visible on the surface. Our
strategy is obviously
working (and very well too) if you feel that these
web-discussions/fights are keeping the public / RTI activists
diverted.

You may also be interested to know that the leading case in the SC on section 4
implementation is an offshoot of these groups. It has CIC pitted
against DoPT pitted against me pitted against DDA. It will surely be a
landmark judgment on RTI. Even
these draft RTI Rules are a direct consequence of this SLP.

FINALLY: the need of the hour is an effective and coordinated response
to the Draft RTI Rules. Any assistance you can offer on this would be
appreciated. The fight against corruption can be discussed / organised
in the New Year.

Best Wishes

Sarbajit Roy

On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Sant Mathur <santmathur@gmail.com> wrote:
> Its important that "content" replaces "form" and "substance" replaces
> "rhetoric".
> The top priority is,and should be to set out agenda.A draft needs to be
> circulated and within a given time-frame,with comments of all stakeholders
> accounted for,finalised.
> A proper action-plan ,with duties and responsibilities defined,of owners of
> different agenda items, then nneds to be drawn up and widely
> circulated.Through a proper review and monotoring mechanism the action-plan
> needs to be pursued,virtually with a missionary zeal.
> Hopefully all members reading this post would have their energies focussed
> on content.avoiding wasteful discusion on form.
> No need to reiterate,absolute requirement in use of graceful language,quite
> in conformity with our glorious culture and heritage.
> While some of the worty ones would like to do a well balanced exercise,just
> a few illustrative points are jottted down here:
> 1.Control and containment of discretion in decision making process at all
> levels.Apex Court judgements and proper legal counsel could help achieve it.
> 2.A simple yet effective document for common people to understand how
> non-implementation or ineffective implementation of the provisions of RTI
> aCT,2005 is detrimental to the interests of different sections of
> society.How directly,or indirectly,women,the children,the rural populace,the
> underprivileged,suffer in short and long run.Need for mobilisation of public
> opinion much more tham vacuuous web-fights is the need of the hour. The
> great causes of the day are goung to be served only through public
> participation in the long-drawn struggle.
> 3.Need to understand why there is lethargy in implementing the provisions of
> sec 4 of the Act so that judicial intervention could be sought and the very
> fact of needing info from PIOs, in most cases ,might become unnecessary.
> 4.Prioritisation of the Ministries/Departments/Organisations/PSUs in terms
> of their vulnerability to (high) level corruption.Likewise within these
> entities again vulnerable areas,as per ABC analysis.
> The seeking of info and its use,say through PIL,nneds to be in the order of
> priority to make optimal use of limited RTI resourses.
> To encapsule decades of varied experience,including 14 years in Vigilance
> and Anti-Corruption areas,is no mean task but its necessary to share the
> quintessence of it in some form to help the great and noble RTI
> Movement,which seems to be often going astray.
> spm
> IPS DGP retd
> BE MBA PhD
> On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 11:05 PM, nilesh suchdev <nilesh.suchdev@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> "Hollow vessels make the most noise." - bull's eye!
>>
>> People who hog limited resources shall be slaughtered like pigs. - hope it
>> applies to all who do that, including moderators and enforcers
>>
>> On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 5:01 PM, sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> This forum is an ideal(ised) democracy to give effect to the RIGHT of
>>> every member to post messages. Abuse of this right leads to expulsion
>>> from the forum. "Enforcers" take steps to prevent abuse and enforce
>>> the rights equally for the BENEFIT of all members..
>>>
>>> Merely because citizen/member X. does not (or chooses not to) post,
>>> does not mean that another member "Y" can usurp Mr.X's right by
>>> claiming to represent/speak for him. Again, merely because somebody
>>> posts more or shouts louder does not confer authority.
>>> "Hollow vessels make the most noise."
>>>
>>> In the real world RTI analogy, there would be limits imposed on the
>>> RTI requests, RTI appeals etc which would be allowed to be filed. In
>>> this way TRUE DEMOCRACY would be achieved.
>>>
>>> If not, there are many "militaries" waiting in the wings (or forests)
>>> to enforce their versions of people's power. People who hog limited
>>> resources shall be slaughtered like pigs.
>>>
>>> Sarbajit
>>>
>>> On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 2:57 PM, nilesh suchdev
>>> <nilesh.suchdev@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > is this a forum or some military regiment...?!!!
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 10:16 AM, S.D. Sharma <anonsharma@yahoo.com>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Kindly be advised that group regulations permit ordinary members
>>> >> to post upto 3 messages per day and 10 messages per month.
>>> >>
>>> >> On exceeding this limit, your group membership / privileges may
>>> >> be affected.
>>
>
>