RE: [IAC++] Respectful advice to navnith

Dear All
I agree with SurajPrakash and Sujit. I also request all readers to spend
time and energy on
* WHAT TO DO ( SUGGESTIONS FOR OTHERS )
* WHAT AM I WILLING TO DO
Even if someone feels that somebody has a wrong thinking or approach, please
take it upon yourself to SELL your thinking to that person, if you have zeal
and time to do so. Please refrain from making derogatory comments publicly
on others because it will only hurt someone's ego and not help the other
person to realize his wrong ( if any ). Every action should have some useful
purpose. What useful purpose is being served by such comments ?
Jaiprakash Taparia

-----Original Message-----
From: iac-request@lists.riseup.net [mailto:iac-request@lists.riseup.net] On
Behalf Of SurajParkash
Sent: 17 November 2012 16:11
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Cc: kumar sohoni
Subject: [IAC++] Respectful advice to navnith

Dear friends :

Comments by navnith are in bad taste and lack of maturity. For the cause of
freedom of India, people with all differing thought and action plans came
forward, who objected to the worklk plans of Gandhi, Subhash, Bhagat Singh,
and many others, but they were all for the same good cause. So also are
Kejriwal, Anna, Medha, and others.

If navnith is serious for the eradication of corruption, he should refrain
from creating any suspicions between varying groups for the common cause,
let each one do his job in the way he thinks best.

SurajParkash

On 11/17/12, Sujit Patwardhan <patwardhan.sujit@gmail.com> wrote:
> You are right.
>
> I'm surprised by the language being used in some of the emails,
> particularly because while we may all have differences in our
> viewpoint I assume we do support action (and activism) to oppose
> Corruption, Inequity and Injustice. It doesn't help when someone says
> " NBA came a cropper due to lack of public support (It didn't. It was
> the split decision of the Supreme Court)".
>
> Also if someone feels "Medha Patkar is roaming the country hogging
> limelight as a crusader" the writer should try to do the same and see
> for himself if that is such a cushy thing to do. Making personal
> derogatory comments without adequate proof is a sure sign of lacking a
> logical argument and contributors to this forum should have the sense
> and maturity to avoid that.
>
> --
> Sujit
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 9:04 AM, kumar sohoni
> <sohonikumar@yahoo.co.in>wrote:
>
>> Anna Hazare should keep his activity in Ralegaon only...
>> Medha Patkar is highly qualified literete and has world class studies
>> 9of any given subject..Anna should not be considedred as Mahatma
>> Gandhi the father of the nation ..he has limitations, in other words
>> not at all qualified literaly as compared to the Bapuji the father
>> of the nation...
>>
>> KUMAR
>> *From:* Navnith Krishnan <navkris@hotmail.com>
>> *To:* iac@lists.riseup.net
>> *Sent:* Thursday, 15 November 2012 7:56 PM
>> *Subject:* RE: [IAC++] Ms. Medha Patkar
>>
>> Medha patkar and Swami Agnivesh are the two sides of the same
>> coin.After her NBA came a cropper mainly because of lack of public
>> suport,she is roaming around the country hogging lime light as a
>> crusader.It is better for Anna and IAC to keep her at arm's length.
>>
>> *navnith*
>> **
>>
>>
>>
>> Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2012 12:34:38 +0530
>> From: sroy.mb@gmail.com
>> To: iac@lists.riseup.net
>> Subject: Re: [IAC++] Ms. Medha Patkar
>>
>> Hi Joya Mashi
>>
>> BTW. Are you sure you want to expose we're related ? I wouldn't.
>> Wouldn't
>> that cause problems in your exalted NGO circles and the IIC crowd ?
>> Anyway,
>> we're all fine. (And when did you sign up with an IAC chapter?)
>>
>> We don't condemn "all" activists. We first question them when they
>> use donated funds / grants without disclosing their conflicts of
>> interest in advance while engaging with us. We especially question
>> them if the donors are foreigners. We challenge the so called definition
of "civil society"
>> as
>> it trivialises the role of "aam aadmi" in an anyway mythical democracy.
>> When our questions are not answered ONLY THEN do we condemn them -
>> preferably in public so that we can be corrected /ticked off if wrong
>> - UNLIKE THE bananas who never condescend to reply.
>>
>> For instance in Medha Patkar's case I willingly modified my claim
>> about her being "foreign financed" because it was mainly based on
>> her getting a Magsaysay award and secondly the allegations of the
>> Ahmedabad NGO.such as at here
>>
>> http://newsbharati.com/Encyc/2012/10/5/Medha-Patkar-s-faux-pas-Blocki
>> ng-info-on-Foreign-Funds-received.aspx
>>
>> So, by your book, its OK to "target" Medha but its bad form when we
>> target :"Aruna" ? Bollocks !
>>
>> FYI, we always knew Medha studied at TISS. The fact that TISS
>> brought out
>> (manufactured) that Narmada report very conveniently for her when NBA
>> was on the ropes in the SC is nether here nor there. Nor is her
>> wikjpedia article which says she was a "past employee in the Tata empire"
>> (coincidentally so also says Arvinds) relevant to the financing debate.
>> What would be relevant would if somebody showed that Medha stalled
>> Singur (as a hired gun) so that Tata empire could hang on to the
>> massive monies mobilised from Nano advance bookings and use it to buy
>> up companies globally and then refinance it 3 or 5 times on the
>> rigged Indian stock markets by judicious insider trading. (That would
>> need a Sucheta Dalal to investigate and follow the money)
>>
>> What is relevant on NBA's corruption is this portion of the 3 judge
>> SC bench in 2011.
>> http://indiankanoon.org/doc/769498/
>>
>> "131. Before adverting to the next issue, it is desirable to deal
>> with the conduct of the NBA. The question is not of justification of
>> the tenure holders to retain possession of the land, rather it had
>> emphatically been argued by Shri Sanjay Parekh, learned counsel
>> appearing for the said applicant/respondent, that powers under
>> Section 48 of the Act 1894 could not be resorted to because the
>> tenure holders had already been physically dispossessed and land
>> stood vested in the State. Therefore, the same could not be divested.
>> The matter was argued by Shri Sanjay Parekh at great length to
>> impress upon the Court that the tenure holders had been actually
>> dispossessed long ago. This fact was denied by the State. It was only
>> after considering the rival submissions on behalf of the parties that
>> this Court thought it fit and appropriate to have a spot inspection
>> report and then the District Judge, Indore, was asked to make a local
>> inspection and submit the report. The report has been made after
>> making an inspection of the area and recording statements of the
>> tenure holders in presence of Shri Alok Agrawal, Chief activist of
>> NBA and thus, we accept the same. It is evident from the said report
>> that statements made by the said applicant/respondent in the Court,
>> in this regard are factually incorrect and false. The Court has been
>> entertaining this petition under the bona fide belief that NBA was
>> espousing the grievance of inarticulate and illiterate poor farmers,
>> with all sincerity and thus, would not make any misleading statement.
>> However, our belief stands fully belied. Applicant / respondent made
>> pleadings and advanced arguments without any basis only to secure
>> unwarranted benefits to those tenure holders. In the instant case it
>> stands discredited totally in the eyes of this Court. This Court had
>> been a little careful and cautious in this regard, which has exposed
>> the true picture.
>>
>> 132. In such a fact-situation, the NBA not having personal interest
>> in the case, cannot claim to be dominus litis. Thus, it ought to have
>> acted at every stage with full sense of responsibility and sincerity.
>> Earlier also, this Court in Narmada Bachao Andolan v. Union of India
>> & Ors.,
>> (1998)
>> 5 SCC 586, has disapproved the conduct of the Narmada Bachao Andolan
>> and described it to be most unfortunate that it had celebrated the
>> 4th anniversary of the stoppage of work of the dam under the interim
>> orders of the Court. This Court found it to be an obstruction in the
>> way of implementing the R&R Policy. However, at that time this Court
>> was assured by the said NBA that they "shall not directly or
>> indirectly give any cause for concern by this Court."; But, in our
>> opinion, it has not been able to keep its solemn undertaking given to
>> this Court."
>>
>> I don't even want to start on Aid-India and its foreign funding as
>> that would require a full book (in 10 volumes) far beyond the 2 odd
>> chapters those vigilonline people wrote about in their
>> NGO-as-Industry-and singing-for supper-book. (I'm sure you have a copy of
it).
>>
>> So what if Aruna Roy supposedly sat on dharna in Rajasthan. Does that
>> give her any special status. I also sat in the SC 13 years ('83-'86)
>> before her getting proo-bono info for poor people ? What makes her
>> corrupt are her actions (eg. touting from under Sonia's
>> extra-Constitutional petticoats) thereafter. (BTW: Every dog, incl.
>> me, claims that the RTI Act 2005 was drafted by them)
>>
>> *Parting shot:* Why, for eg., is water in Delhi being handed over to
>> Tata and Reliance (L&T) in the same way as they did Electricity ?
>> Because of these NGO 'haramis" who collaborate with their - fake
>> "hands off" R&D NGOs like TERI ('bijli'/'transport') and
>> IMWI-TATA('pani) to do it. And yet Medha says that Tatas are honest
>> {I'm sure I'll find that news report eventually - till then read
>> these).
>>
>> *Links (further reading)*:
>>
>> http://dharmanext.blogspot.in/2012/01/truth-about-medha-patkar.html
>>
>>
>> http://www.dailypioneer.com/nation/65407-sc-refuses-to-expunge-remark
>> s-against-medha-patkars-nba.html
>>
>>
>> http://www.firstpost.com/politics/land-wars-anand-mahindra-debates-me
>> dha-patkar-111301.html
>>
>> Sarbajit
>> *National Convenor
>> India Against Corruption** - Jan Andolan
>> *
>> On 11/15/12, Prodipto Roy <prodipto.r@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Hullo,
>> >
>> > Why this blanket condemnation of all 'activists' (i.e., concerned
>> > citizens who go public)?
>> >
>> > I thought you targeted Medha because you found out that she was a
>> > TISS alumni, hence 'funded' by Tatas. NBA does get 'foreign' funds,
>> > from AIDIndia, for example, started by Ravi Kuchimanchi, an IIT
>> > engineer I believe. They built the microhydels for NBA in
>> > Maharashtra and supplied grain for Bhil families who were stranded
>> > on 'tapu' hilltops when SSP waters cut them off from the dry land.
>> >
>> > Aruna Roy sat on dharna with hundreds of other concerned citizens
>> > till the RTI act was passed in Rajasthan. What's 'corrupt' about
>> > her activities? I know anyone can write anything on the Net but you
>> > should be more concerned with facts, evidence, and the reliability
>> > of your sources than with tarring everyone with the same brush.
>> >
>> > How are you all otherwise?!
>> >
>> > Joya (Mashi)
>> >
>> > On 11/14/12, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> Dear Friends
>> >>
>> >> It seems I have posted 2 emails describing among other things Ms.
>> >> Medha
>> >> Patkar (and Arvind Kejriwal) as "*foreign financed*". A few kind
>> >> people have brought this (and another item concerning the lady
>> >> activist) to my attention causing me to research the matter
>> >> further.
>> >>
>> >> I must say that I had made this statement based on my recollection of.
>> >>
>> >> a) Certain Supreme Court orders in NBA matters last year,
>> >> b) Activism and PR of an Ahmedabad based NGO - NCCL or suchlike
>> >> c) A series of news reports which described Ms. Medha Patkar as a
>> >> Magsaysay awardee (the latest series of which was about 6 days
>> >> back when she was arrested and got bail etc.). Everyone who reads
>> >> me regularly knows my views on awards/awardees like this which are
>> >> only awarded to corrupt people.
>> >>
>> >> It seems I may have been wrong on the Magsaysay award (and I
>> >> couldn't locate it on the RMAF website either when I checked). For
>> >> what its worth the news stories which misled me were
>> >>
>> >>
>> http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2010-01-07/india/28114789
>> _1_naxal-hit-areas-narmada-bachao-andolan-tribals
>> >>
>> http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2012-11-07/bhopal/3497230
>> 0_1_medha-patkar-kss-activists-narmada-bachao-andolan
>> >>
>> http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2012-11-08/bhopal/3499308
>> 3_1_medha-patkar-personal-bond-kss
>> >>
>> http://zeenews.india.com/news/nation/corruption-systemic-change-anna-
>> hazares-new-targets_810317.html
>> >>
>> http://zeenews.india.com/news/nation/anna-hazare-holds-meeting-in-del
>> hi_810317.html
>> >>
>> >> and a string of others which any can search for on google.
>> >>
>> >> So I am (temporarily) modifying my statement that Ms. Patkar is
>> >> foreign financed (Magsaysay CIA spy by implication like Arvind,
>> >> Kiran Bedi,
>> Aruna
>> >> Roy etc...) till I fully research the matter again. My thanks to
>> >> those who pointed this out and my apology(s) to any/everybody who
>> >> was offended.
>> >>
>> >> I am also open to discuss another aspect which is being
>> >> communicated in private emails to me from a certain IAC section on
>> >> this list.
>> >>
>> >> Namely that while Arvind's group is completely corrupt, money
>> >> obsessed and tainted (which is why the political option suits them
>> >> to a T) but Anna and Medha etc. (but not Kiran Bedi - who is
>> >> needed for other reasons) are mature/decent/honest/simple folk
>> >> with long track records of grassroots clean activism etc. but
>> >> who simply cannot function with Arvind.
>> >> Since
>> >> this a open mailing list I suppose, all knowledgeable subscribers
>> >> should and ought to write in so that all dimensions / truth of the
>> >> IAC fracture/implosion emerge and can be chronicled for future
>> >> researchers.
>> >>
>> >> Sarbajit
>> >>
>> >
>>
>> WWW : http://indiaagainstcorruption.net.in
>> Post: iac@lists.riseup.net
>> Quit: iac-unsubscribe@lists.riseup.net
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>>
>>
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
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> *
>
> - J. Krishnamurti
>
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> Sujit Patwardhan
> patwardhan.sujit@gmail.com
> sujit@parisar.org <sujitjp@gmail.com>
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SurajParkash
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