Gladly. My father, a Bihar ICS originally from Sylhet in Bangladesh, was not only a distinguished Sanskrit student of Govt. College, Lahore, but a polyglot who learnt several European languages as well as Pali. While in Bihar as a magistrate he excavated Buddhist sites in Rajgriha on the basis of Xuan Xang's and Cunningham's accounts - sources that were more than 1200 years apart. He noted how Buddhist thought and literature from the famed universities of Nalanda, Vikramashila, Taxila and Odantapuri had been obliterated from Indian history, their legacy found now only in Tibetan, Chinese and late Pali of Sri Lanka. HMG's government denied him permission to learn Tibetan so he focused on mainly the early Pali sources.
From being a Brahma Samaji (his father was outcaste from the Brahminical fold when he went to study with non-Brahmins in Presidency College, Calcutta) he became a crypto-Buddhist, like the great Shankara who absorbed Prasangika Madhyamika ideas into his own thinking while at the same time preserving the old system of caste hierarchy and varnashram dharma.
My maternal great grandfather Navin Chandra Rai was the foremost Sanskrit educator of the 19th Century. See his Varnalipi, long used as a Sanskrit textbook in UP and the Punjab.
Due to my forbears' modern outlook, our family suffered by losing all land assets in our native Bengal at the hands of unscrupulous Brahminical priests. The same ones who quote Vedas which attribute origin of OBCs and dalits (the majority population) to the unclean nether parts of Vedic godhead. And who annointed any foreign invader be they Saka, Huna, Gurjara, Yueh Chi, Bactrians, Scythians or Greeks, Kshatriya status to rule over society and compensate in return the Brahmins with courtly posts and sacred functions. Freedom from caste restrictions opened up many new intellectual activities and professions to my family as my elders were able to travel abroad and live anywhere to study and work, in science, medicine and law.
I am an editor and student of English literature who sadly refused to study Sanskrit from the fat, pan chewing Banarasi Brahmins my father hired as teachers. In my 70th year I became a student of the extensive Buddhist literature on Logic, epistemology, debate, metaphysics and phenomenology extant in Tibetan and reintroduced to Indian students in the Nalanda Masters Course by Tibetan masters from monastic colleges relocated in India after 1959.
We study all Indian Darshans briefly and the 4-6 main Buddhist schools intensively, from Vaibhasika and Cittamatra including the Yogacara school Xuan Xang came all the way from the Chinese capital in Xian to study in Kashmir, Bihar and Tamilnadu, then Buddhist kingdoms, and we study the so called highest school of Prasangika Madhyamika of Acharya Nagarjuna, Chandrakirti, Shantideva and other great (Brahmin!) Nalanda pandits. High and low in this context implies extent of reliance by any school of thought on logical analysis of assertions on any subject and critical reasoning.
Hence my interest in authentic sources in any religious tradition quoted by anybody in defense of their own traditions, including those Vedic sources your esteemed assertions are based on. Debate and friendly discussion were once the hallmark of a true scholar in Bharatvarsha.
Joya Roy
Dear Madame Ms Joya Roy,I am no Vedic Scholar nor a Socialist Activist nor Sociologist. There is some mistake about it. In fact, I have been trying to unsubscribe unsuccessfully from this INDIARESIST.Some times I pass on to learned Vedic, Brig Raj B Sharma and Rear Admiral JJ Baxi, who are both active on FACEBOOK. You may like to join their Trail.Who would you describe yourself, please.Regards,Prem Batra============================================================ ====== On Mon, 10 Sep 2018 at 09:08, Prodipto Roy <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net> wrote: Dear Prem ji, please give the link to your Vedic online site. One always needs chapter and verse numbers.
By the way, I am Joya Roy, using Gmail ID of my late husband, sociologist Prodipto Roy (Ph. D., Penn.)
Post: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.netOn 6 Sep 2018 7:27 p.m., "Prem Sabhlok" <sab_prem@hotmail.com> wrote:Dear Sh. Prodipto Roy,
Thanks for your email
I have no where mentioned Athrava Veda gave the exact time. I have mentioned "When soul was provided to human beings" The two statements are vastly different.
There are a lot of Pious forgeries going on to prove what fake gurus/swamis say is correct and Vedas are false.
I have quoted Veda mantra/rik/hymns number in my e-book Glimpses of Vedic Metaphysics.RegardsPrem Sabhlok
From: Prodipto Roy <prodipto.r@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2018 7:40 AM
To: Prem Sabhlok; indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Subject: Re: Arrest widespread of Pious Forgeries by reviving Vedas Truthfully- Relevance of Vedas to the Present AgeSablok ji: Whenever you quote any Vedic book, kindly give the reference to the exact mandal, verse and line of the text. For example, you wrote that Atharva Veda gave the exact time when humans were given souls. I am interested in this from a comparative perspective and need to know in which chapter, verse and line this occurs. Then we can check online versions of different Vedic books.
And what did that reference to pious forgeries mean? Whose forgeries, for what purpose? And what is the connection with the arrests of poets, writers and lawyers working for the voiceless downtrodden whom the state in collusion with big multinational companies are dispossessing ?
Thank you, Joya Roy
On 3 Sep 2018 4:09 a.m., "Prem Sabhlok" <sab_prem@hotmail.com> wrote:
Rig Veda mentions that the greatest service to God is to spread the spirit of Vedas with honesty, straight-forwardness, without deceit of any kind, for all to enjoy true and spiritual happiness. By understanding the philosophy, metaphysics, knowledge and various models contained in the Vedas, we can perhaps find viable solutions to our present social, economic, political and religious problems.Vedic metaphysics can save the mankind from all kinds of social, economic and other depressions. Strengthen Sanatan Dharma (the eternal religion) through revival of Vedas.The followers of Vedic metaphysics can become paramjot- the carriers of Vedic divine light (knowledge)Dear Spiritual Brothers and Sisters,Subject: Vedas and their relevance to the present age.Owing to utility of Vedic metaphysics to the mankind, UNESCO has accorded Heritage status to Vedas. These scriptures of yore explain comprehensively many divine, spiritual and material subjects and guidelines given there in can help in Universal Brotherhood (Viswa Bandhutva) and development of scientific temper.Adi Grantha says, "Asankh grantha mukhi Ved path"- there are innumerable scriptures but study of Vedas is supreme. It also says, "OMKAR Ved Nirmayi"- Vedas were revealed by God- hence Vedas are Shruti.Atharva Veda makes it clear when soul was provided to human beings, Vedic knowledge was revealed as human soul contains all the Vedic knowledge. Vedic metaphysicists (Rsis) and wise wandering sages (Munnies) through meditation communicated with their souls which are vachispatiah (i.e. human soul- Atma has a sound and can communicate with us) and acquired Vedic knowledge. Rig Veda tells us that soul was provided to human beings so that the purpose of human birth could be known to human beings.Rig Veda further mentions the purpose of human birth is to assist the Vishwakarma (Supreme Reality/Architect) to assist Him in the maintenance of His Grand wondrous Design by following Rta- Cosmic laws of social, moral and physical order. Having created these laws (Rta) even God follows them sternly lest great harm is done to His Creation.Some of these Rta are "as you sow so shall you reap", follow path of moderation, "Iddm nan mam"- nothing for self all for society (enlightened liberalism) and many others.When human beings followed Vedic teachings and guidelines Vedic Sanatan Dharma (eternal religion) was spread beyond Caucasus, Prasava (Persia), Ariana (Iran), Indian sub continent, South Esat Asia JAVA, Samatra, Tashik Khand (Tashkand) etc.Many Greeks, Parthians, Kushans and many others merged with this divine Dharma without any kind of conversion. Rig Veda mentions "Rtam, Satyam, Dharmmam" as Vedic Dharma. Rta-Cosmic Laws of social, moral and physical order are eternal truths (Satyam) and following these Laws (Rta) is Vedic Dharma.Under the vehement effect of dreaded materialism of Charvakaas the followers of Sanatan Dharma started deviating from Vedic Metaphysics (Upanishadic part of Vedas), Buddhism overtook Sanatan Dharma and history tells us that Adi Sankracharya revived Vedas and Buddhism virtually vanished from India . The message of later Rsis/Swamis/Maharisis is very clear "Revive Veda and save the mankind from self destruction".Vedas for modern ageOur social interaction is limited to friends, relations etc but not to community so our houses are spotlessly clean and surroundings dirty as community welfare is never our Motto- Vedas take us to community welfare and "WE" Feeling.2. In social service the concept of Success is difficult to define- so it is better to be a man of value than of success.3. Research in social sciences and medical sciences has found that helping others not for recognition is good for heart. It is great way to exercise your heart and soul.4. Vedas specifically guide us to TEACH (transparency, ethics, accountability, community and humanity welfare) principle. Most of the modern systems have failed in this regard.5. Unless self rule at the grass root level is there in Democracy, the rulers tend to become autocratic, corrupt, hypocrite and tyrannical (Plato). There is no visible movement for swaraj- self rule in India.Ishta theory of Vedas describes paths could be different so long as these paths aim at the welfare of mankind and other animate and inanimate life. Vedas do not consider matter as inert and explain in a large number of hymns that matter has unsuspected vitality. All religions should aim at unity in diversity i.e. (should lead to universal brotherhood-viswa bandhutva), global family of the same One God (vasudhaivan kutumbkam), global trade and global market for the material and spiritual welfare of mankind. God being formless, ineffable and self-created, avoid explaining God through categories, substance, activity, quality and relationship. HE is beyond cognition, perception of human senses, logic of mind and intellect. Words recoil to explain the Supreme Reality. Only true and harmonised material, spiritual and divine knowledge (para jnan) can unite all religions to compete with each other for the welfare of mankind.For the theists with material and intellectual knowledge, multiplicity of gods is seen in the form of idols, icons and incarnation of God as a human being. Some such individuals even find God/god as partly a man and partly a woman (Ardhanari Iswaran). Any individual who starts moving towards para jnan (higher knowledge), all arguments start and end at One formless and ineffable God who is Sat, Chit, Anand - the only reality, supreme consciousness, and bliss.What is admirable in the Vedas is that their powerful and comprehensive philosophy was created for all ages and for the entire mankind. This philosophy was made available at a time when most parts of the world had hallucinations of ghosts getting out of dead bodies, when shadow was interpreted as the soul, spirit, ghosts, and the soul was considered to be getting out of the body at night during dreams. It was the period when the concept of inner and outer world was highly confused. Out of fear complex the ancient man worshipped snakes, animals, plants, and clouds by creating millions of gods with form. When in most parts of the world the religion of animism was wide spread, the Vedic metaphysics was getting developed in the areas which now lie in the states of Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Georgia, Pakistan and some Northern parts of India. Arya Vrata was the land spreading up to Parshavas ( Persia ), Ariana (later Iran ) and this land was not a fairy tale country, since the Vedas nowhere describe mythology as part of metaphysics.The Dark Age or Kali yuga has the predominance of avarnas and vritras. In this Age owing to spread of only material and intellectual knowledge bereft of divine and spiritual knowledge, the predominant features are superstitions, unscientific outlook, blind faith, hypocrisy, naked selfishness and wide spread corruption. Fake gurus and god-men who get hallucination that they are the incarnation of various gods on this earth, multiply. Thus Vedic metaphysics meant for the guidance of human beings of this Dark Age is largely ignored. However, the study of Vedas would reveal that Vedic gurus (Gu- darkness and Ru- to dispel) are the dispellers of both inner and outer darkness. They are more like Socrates, Mencius, St Augustine, Immanuel Kant, Sankrachrya, Guru Nanak and swami Daya Nanda and do not bear any resemblance to the modern godmen, gurus, babas, tantriks and swamis.A perusal and study of "Glimpses of Vedic Metaphysics" on the Internet can give more details on the subject. The seekers of Vedic knowledge can access this book through website http://www.sabhlokcity.com/metaphysics/ OR through google.com/ yahoo.com/ lulu.com. Search for the Book.With warm regards,Yours spiritual brother,Prem SabhlokVedas contain many other subjects like:1. Vedas explain scientifically divine, spiritual and material knowledge.2. Material economics not based on inert matter3. Purpose of life and human Birth4. Why Vedas are referred as Shruti(Heard/directly revealed through human soul)5. Education system for allocating four divine Varna6. Science is useful but scientific temper is more important.7. Universal brotherhood, global family8. Equality of men and women,9. All religions to compete for the welfare of mankind- they could vary due to local conditions for environment, culture etc10 Tri-ani-pada (three bodies in one)11. Apriori- Knowledge12. Concept of Moderation13. Iddam nan mmam (nothing for self all for society)14. Earth is not a quarry for exploitation15. No Caste system based on birth16. Spiritual science against present egoistic commercial spiritualism17. Rtam, Satyam Dharmmam.and many other subjects.
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