Saturday, December 11, 2010

Re: [HumJanenge] RTI Unification advisory

Whats this?
 
Why no discussion on draft RTI rules?
 
And what is this issue abt digvijay? Unless it is rti related this can certainly be barred.
 
ravi
On Sun, Dec 12, 2010 at 12:25 AM, RTI UNITY <rti.unity@gmail.com> wrote:
[DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE]

ADVISORY 2010/12/002


To all members / moderators
1. [rti_india]
2. [humjanenge]
3. [rti4empowerment]

Circulating emails over the afore mentioned RTI google mailing lists on the following topical subjects shall result in instant revocation of  group membership.

a. DoPT's draft  RTI Rules
b. Digvijay Singh

This advisory is issued on behalf of, and in the interest of, all group members / cityzens as a short term measure to limit volume of group message posts.

RU project coordinator

Re: [HumJanenge] Need volunteers to devote 2 hours per week.

Dear Mr Dabral
 
Please post the information you need in this group and I too shall support you in filing applications and getting whatever info that is available.
 
regards n bw
 
ravi

On Wed, Dec 8, 2010 at 11:26 AM, jayaprakash dabral <jp_dabral@rediffmail.com> wrote:
The Himalayan Chipko Foundation needs volunteers to :
1. file and follow up RTI applications 
2. collect data through internet search

The information is required to enable us to stop the timber mafia from cutting trees in the Himalayas and elsewhere. 
Those interested in volunteering about two hours per week or four hours per month please contact : The volunteers have to work from their homes. 

JP Dabral
President 
Himalayan Chipko Foundation
Phone: 9868277171



Re: [HumJanenge] Need volunteers to devote 2 hours per week.

I am ready to work for 2 hrs in week

Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone


From: "Dr. NC JAIN" <j_nc@hotmail.com>
Sender: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2010 06:48:09 +0000
To: <humjanenge@googlegroups.com>
ReplyTo: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: [HumJanenge] Need volunteers to devote 2 hours per week.

Dear sir
   I am ready to volunteer but I am stationed at Pitampura Delhi  after my retirement from BARC Mumbai. 
Dr N C Jain
12-12-10
 

Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2010 13:21:28 +0530
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Need volunteers to devote 2 hours per week.
From: jkgroup999@gmail.com
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com

i am ready to volunteer
K N Jagadesh kumar
09845500932
RTI activist/LL.B

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 11:34 AM, wehelp <wehelpngo@gmail.com> wrote:


Dear Shri JP Dabral-Ji,
This is in response to your Appeal for Volunteers.
 
 
 
I am ready to volunteer for your organisation. Please give me the details of your organisation
 
 
 
Thank you 
Jithendar Reddy
wehelpngo
karimnagar andhra pradesh  9701778357
 
 
 
 



--
K N Jagadesh Kumar
9845500932
jkgroup999@gmail.com

RE: [HumJanenge] Need volunteers to devote 2 hours per week.

Dear sir
   I am ready to volunteer but I am stationed at Pitampura Delhi  after my retirement from BARC Mumbai. 
Dr N C Jain
12-12-10
 

Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2010 13:21:28 +0530
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Need volunteers to devote 2 hours per week.
From: jkgroup999@gmail.com
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com

i am ready to volunteer
K N Jagadesh kumar
09845500932
RTI activist/LL.B

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 11:34 AM, wehelp <wehelpngo@gmail.com> wrote:


Dear Shri JP Dabral-Ji,
This is in response to your Appeal for Volunteers.
 
 
 
I am ready to volunteer for your organisation. Please give me the details of your organisation
 
 
 
Thank you 
Jithendar Reddy
wehelpngo
karimnagar andhra pradesh  9701778357
 
 
 
 



--
K N Jagadesh Kumar
9845500932
jkgroup999@gmail.com

[rti4empowerment] Re: Poll results for rti4empowerment

Dear Ms Singh

As a moderator of RTI4empowerment.yahoogroup I closed the idiotic poll started by Mr Dhirendra Krishna when I observed the trend going against him. The automatically generated final results were posted to both yahoo and google groups.

Now I find that Mr Krishna has reopened the poll to try and rig the results and deleted the results from the Yahoo group.

list owner

--- In rti4empowerment@yahoogroups.com, "Urvi Sukul Singh" <usukulsingh@...> wrote:
>
> Dear Mr Krrishna,
> Who is bringing out this idiotic poll and results?I think there is some mischief being played as the poll was posed from rti4emp@yahoo and the results come on the googlegroups?What rubbish is going on?
> Urvi
>
>
> From: RTI4Emp
> Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 11:45 PM
> To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
> Subject: [rti4empowerment] Poll results for rti4empowerment
>
>
> Poll results for rti4empowerment
>
> The following rti4empowerment poll is now closed. Here are the final results:
>
> POLL QUESTION: The policy for allowing illegal immigration is under consideration. Views of members of yahoo group rti4empowerment are solicited, for sending a representation to the Prime Minister of India. The question to be considered is whether it is in India's national interest to allow illegal migrants from neighboring countries?
>
> What do you think ?
>
> CHOICES AND RESULTS
>
> - Yes, existing practice should continue,. 0 votes, 0.00%
> - No, effective measures should be taken to prevent them, 1 vote,  25.00%
> - Any one who criticizes such illegal entry is an "hindu bigot" and should be condemned,  3 votes, 75.00%
> - International borders have lost their significance in glogalized environment,  0 votes,  0.00%
> - Any other views. ( Please specify by posting a message in yahoo group rti4empowerment.),  0 votes, 0.00%
>
> For more information about this group, please visit
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rti4empowerment
>
> For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit
> http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/forms/general.html
>

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 11:45 PM, RTI4Emp <rti4empowerment.owner@gmail.com> wrote:
Poll results for rti4empowerment

The following rti4empowerment poll is now closed. Here are the final results:

POLL QUESTION: The policy for allowing illegal immigration is under consideration. Views of members of yahoo group rti4empowerment are solicited, for sending a representation to the Prime Minister of India. The question to be considered is whether it is in India's national interest to allow illegal migrants from neighboring countries?

What do you think ?

CHOICES AND RESULTS

- Yes, existing practice should continue,. 0 votes, 0.00%
- No, effective measures should be taken to prevent them, 1 vote,  25.00%
- Any one who criticizes such illegal entry is an "hindu bigot" and should be condemned,  3 votes, 75.00%
- International borders have lost their significance in glogalized environment,  0 votes,  0.00%
- Any other views. ( Please specify by posting a message in yahoo group rti4empowerment.),  0 votes, 0.00%

For more information about this group, please visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rti4empowerment

For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit
http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/forms/general.html

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Mr Roy has raised a valid issue here and it is others, like Rajeev Kumar who have tried to introduce caste and communal and political factors. The Nehru-usurper Gandhi family has created most of the mess we are in. Even the surname Gandhi in Feroze Gandhi has been usurped by Nehru to mislead the public and we know now how far this misuse has helped them with Sonia usurper Gandhi being invited even by the UN to address its General Assembly on the Mahatma's birthday! The original surname of Feroze,a parsi, was Gandhy. G N S Raghavan in his book the 'Press in India- a new history' has written:
 
The respectful suffix ji is employed in this work to distinguish the future Mahatma who was born in Porbandar from the Gandhis of Allahabad. The surname of Feroze born in a Bombay based Parsi family and brought up by his elder sister at Allahabad used to be spelt as 'Gandhy', in the Parsi fashion, till his engagementwith Jawaharlal Nehru's daughter in Mar 1942. The spelling was changed to Gandhi in a press statement issued by Jawaharlal Nehru confirming the engagement.
 
You can imagine the scheming mind of Nehru if you understand that even today we are being damned as a male dominated society and when it comes to surnames it was only a couple of years back that it was reported that Priyanka Nehru-usurper Gandhi-Vadhra got a PR officer removed because he had spelt her hubby's surname mispelt in an invitation!
 
Now coming to the issue of RTI that started this thread, I am no more under the delusion that it is being implemented even by a barge pole. The information commissioners and courts had put it on ventilator even before it reached the masses. Today we are in a situation in this country where the petty criminals get caught and are punished not just illegally but even inhumanely, the professional criminals go scot free and the master minds get venerated! Today I only pray that the maoists choose their targets correctly whenever they strike. Theirs may not be enviable governance we desire if at all they are able to come to power but right now they seem to be the better option and I, for one, definitely look at them as today's freedom fighters.
 
regards n bw
 
ravi

 
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 1:40 PM, rajeev kumar <yadavrajeev_2005@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
Sir,
 
This is the point on which few Hindu elements that had always propogated communal agends have hiccups when they see vote of Congress government in each state of India. Indira Gandhi married to a Muslim and therefore Rajiv gandhi was a muslim and so in Rahul gandhi. But whats wrong in it, both Feroz and Indira were Indians. Your agenda of hared falls flat but it gives huge shocks to those Hindus who vote for Congress and hate Muslims. So correct your facts.
 
Regards,
Rajeev Yadav,
National President,
Adhikaar the rights path,
+919811242471
www.adhikaar.in

--- On Sat, 11/12/10, sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com> wrote:

From: sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 1:34 PM


It is clear that the old British tactics of "divide and rule" can
still be applied
in India today.

My challenge is a simple one

1) Sonia Gandhi and her children and their spouses are the de-facto
rulers of India.

2) Members of this family sit in Parliament and shape/ vote on
legislation which affects all of us, including on personal laws.

3) The media makes a big thing out of the fact that they visit and eat
in Dalit households.

In this context every citizen has a right to know

1) What the religion of Members of Parliament like Sonia Gandhi and
Rahul Gandhi is

2) Furthermore, if they belong to a religion which has caste then what
that caste is.

Every Indian citizen has to declare their religion at various
occasions which is information in Govt Records. Every publicly
accessible record concerning the religion and caste of these MPs and
Prime Ministers has been rendered inaccessible or destroyed. I am not
speaking about Census records which are privileged, but documents
which citizens have.a right to inspect at any time.

Let me summarise the material available in public domain on these questions.

1) Feroze Gandhi was a Parsi. He never converted out of Zorastrianism,

2) Indira Gandhi was a Kashmiri Pandit (Hindu). In 1930 she renounced
Hindusim and converted to Adi Dharm religion.

3) Indira Nehru and Feroze Gandhi married under Adi Dharm Vedic rites
at Allahabad and their marriage was registered in Allahabad under
Special Marriage Act 1872. After some objections were raised against
this marriage ("completely illegal marriage") Jahawarlal Nehru
arranged for a Arya Samaj marriage certificate under Arya Marriage
Validation Act 1939  by submitting a memorandum (as father of bride)
claiming that Feroze Gandhi has converted to Hinduism and underwent
suddhikaran. A claim which Feroze Gandhi always denied.

4) It is very well known that Jawaharlal Nehru who had no other legal
heir broke up this marriage and 'kidnapped" Rajiv Gandhi and Sanjay
Gandhi to bring them up and did not
allow Feroze Gandhi to see them. Some investigtors have even claimed
that Nehru hastened
Feroze Gandhi's demise.

5) Rajiv Gandhi married Sonia Gandhi by Vedic rites, and got marriage
registered in Delhi under Special Marriage Act 1954 on basis of
marriage certiifcate issued by Arya Samaj. Until 2007 these papers
were at Patiala House Court New Delhi. In the supporting affidavits it
was written that Rajiv Gandhi's religion as "Adi Dharm" and Sonia
Maino as "Christian-Roman Catholic". This was also entered in certain
diaries maintained by the Marriage Officer. These diaries also
contained the records of numerous other citizens. All these records
have now disappeared.

6) Assuming for a moment that all the above information is true, and
Rajiv Gandhi was a converted Arya Samaji or Adi Dharmi then in terms
of Hindu shastra he has no caste or at best the lowest caste.

7) When Rajiv Gandhi was assassinated, he was cremated at public
expense. Surely the citizens have a right to know why the child of a
Parsi father was cremated at huge public expense instead of being
exposed at a Tower of Silence.

If there is any person here who is competent enough to draft a
"responsible" RTI request to know the religion and caste of Sonia
Gandhi or Rahul Gandhi, please discuss it, or I shall withdraw this
challenge and mark it up as a loss against this group and a win for
me.

Sarbajit


Re: [rti4empowerment] Poll results for rti4empowerment

Dear All,
 
Every country should have a well defined policy. However, consider scores of Indians who illegally emigrate to USA Europe  etc. Even India is formed by illegal immigration from all over the world over the time immemorial.
 
Read this:
 
HAR ZOR ZULLUM KE TAKKAR MEIN, KAAFLE BASTEY GAYE; HINDUSTAAN BANTAA GAYAA!
 
India  has accepted  with open arms anybody seeking assylum.
 
 
About "HINDU BIGOT" let us enlighten ourselves that human beings of different ethnicity exist in this world!!! For further enlightenment read the folllowing:

-BLIND BELIEF-DOES GOD EXIST??????!!!!!

 

Please ponder over these very rational statements.

Most amongst the human beings believe that God exists.

For some it is either Brahma, Vishnu or Maheshwar or one of the 399 Gods & Goddesses or scores of spirits & ghosts,

For some, it is Jesus Christ,

For some it is Allah,

For some it is Buddha,

For some it is any of Jain Tirtankars,

For some any of the Gurus of Sikhism so on & so forth.

We quarrel amongst ourselves that we are Hindus, Christians, Sikhs, Muslims, Jains, Buddhists, etc., but, has any God or Goddess revealed himself or herself to any one of us to either endorse our quarrel or decry it? Answer is an emphatic NO!

Does any one who dies, return to tell tale about? Answer also is an emphatic NO!

Is SWARG or NARAK, JANNAT or JEHANNUM, HEAVEN or HELL a large celestial world? If YES, how much of it is under control of any of these;

BRAHMA, VISHNU, MAHESHWAR & 399 GODS & GODDESSES OR ALLAH, JESUS CHRIST, BUDDHA ETC., so on & so forth? There is no answer!

If one or some change ones or their faith, which Swarg or Narak,  Jannat or Jehnnum, Heaven or Hell that one or those reach? None knows the answer!

Do these Gods & Goddesses retain accounting books with them so that those who forsake a faith shall be a debit entry in the forsaken God/Goddess's book and credit entry in embraced God/Goddess's book? None knows the answer!

If these Gods/Goddesses are OMNISCIENT, OMNIPOTENT, OMNIPERVADING do they need Temples, Mosques, Churches, Basadis, Gompas, Gurudwaras? Answer obviously is an emphatic NO!

If these Gods/Goddesses exist, why Allah did not prevent demolition of Babri Mosque; why did Brahma, Vishnu, Maheswar & other 399 Gods & Goddesses did not prevent the demolition of scores of temples in India & outside after demolition of Babri Mosque? Likewise, why Jesus Christ did not prevent demolition of churches in history? So much so, the Jain Sikh & Buddhist Gods prevent the demolition of the respective places of worships whenever they occurred in the history? E.g. Jain temples in Southern India & Buddhist temples in Northern India WERE converted to Hindu temples in the late second century A.D. when Hinduism usurped trampling Jainism & Buddhism in India ? Any answers? Obviously NO!

Is there any evidence of war or quarrel amongst or conquest of any of the Gods & Goddesses by the other? Answer is obviously NO!

Followers of various faiths quarrel among themselves & one another without any interference from any of the Gods. Just as in the case of political parties, party leaders do not quarrel but, party workers quarrel for the leaders sustain injuries & losses. What a paradox! Any reasons? Answer is yet again an emphatic NO!

Religions are being used just as political parties trying to create vote bank, by Swamis, Mullah's & others, Priests or numerous Godmen & Godwomen prompting their followers to quarrel for them.

Why Gods & Goddesses exist only for Human Beings & not for reptiles, birds & Animals? Any answers? Obviously NO!

In Punarjanm or Reincarnation, cow is one form of Punarjanm. Visualise a Hindu, A Muslim, a Christian, a Sikh, A Jain, A Buddhist, so on & so forth having a cow each and  if these sell their cows amongst themselves; does the cow sold relinquishes worship of God/Goddess of its earlier master/mistress & begin to worship God/Goddess of its new master/mistress? Any answers? Obviously NO!

Which of the Gods/Goddesses the scores of birds, reptiles, animals in jungle worship? Any answers? Obviously NO!

Human beings in the world speak scores of languages. Why these Gods/Goddesses standardize the languages spoken by their adorers? Any answers? Obviously NO!

Sun shines evenly without discrimination upon a Hindu (any sect) Christian (any denomination) Muslim( any denomination)  so on & so forth. So does when it rains!

A cat mews identically in a house of a Hindu (any sect) Christian (any denomination) Muslim ( any denomination) so on & so forth!

A cow yields milk & milk alone regardless whether it is in the house of a Hindu (any sect) Christian ( any denomination) Muslim( any denomination) so on & so forth!

So does a dog or any other mammal that is reared!

 

Every Purohit or Bhat, or Priest or Mullah or Sant avers that God always tests a devotee by giving him or her testing times & travails to ensure that he/she is steadfast in his/her devotion and also those who undergo travails & tribulations are ensured happiness in the other world; whereas, to bring the wrongdoer into God's fold God is extra benevolent to him/her! What a paradoxical justice! What is it anyway; nothing but HUMBUG!

 

Every faith propagates that the human beings were created by the creator, The God! In that case why the Gods created Human speaking different languages, different races, skin colour etc.?

Why the Gods created Humans with uneven distribution of wealth, intellect & ability?

Are so named or called Hindus, Muslims, Sikhs, Jains, Christians, Buddhists etc., so on & so forth, denote or connote different ethnic or groups? Answer obviously is No!

These are only groups owing allegiance to different schools of thought! Just as political parties!

All Gods or Goddesses may at best historical personalities or creation of fertile imagination & nothing else!

 

So, it is futile to build places of worship, e.g. TEMPLES, MOSQUES, CHURCHES, GURUDWARAS, JAIN & BUDDISTS TEMPLES so on & so forth & waste resources in propitiation, votive offerings etc.,

All those God-men, God-women, priests, swamis, mullahs etc., exist by profession; only a CRAFT to earn one's livelihood! Just as Sanskrit saying; UDHARA BHARANUM; BAHUKRITA VESHAM!

 

Further, every religion claims that all humans have a soul but, birds, animals, reptiles etc., have none! What a partisan dispensation by the God!!!???

 

"I helped give birth to three children with the human cloning technique, known as genetic recoding. It involved two boys and a girl who are nine years old today. They were born healthy and they are in excellent health now." said Severino Antinori, a prominent gynaecologist, to Oggi, an Italian weekly in an interview that appeared on Wednesday, the 4th of February 2009.Do these two boys & one girl who were created by Severino Antinori have souls???!!! Any answers???!!!

 

In India, recent statistics indicate that about 76% of Indian population subsist by earning just Rs. 25 a day. This population also worships different Gods/Goddesses, align themselves to varied faiths, pray, offer votives, pay obeisance! Alas! None of the Gods/Goddesses have alleviated them from this morass or predicament! So why waste time & spend hard earned money in these futile exercises?

 

India, our motherland is so diverse, linguistically, ethnically and anthropologically with over 4000 languages about over 1600 religious practices and equally large ethnic origins; it can be equated to an extremely large, massively grown tree; in the boughs & branches immigrant birds from far and wide, genetically & specieally very diverse, have perched and built their nests laid eggs in them, incubated them into fledglings which became fully fledged to further the genus. This tree, the mother India has sheltered them and offered them a habitat & continue to do so without any discrimination on genus & specie!

 

Hence, no specie of any genus can claim proprietary right on this tree!

Those countrymen & women who on the basis of religion & God, spread hatred, strife, riots, vandalism, loot, unrest, massacre, bloodshed, lawlessness, anarchy, economic halt, shredding human fibre to pieces that cannot be rewoven into a fabric, are responsible for the tears those are shed from the eyes of hapless kith & kins of those who lose their parents, siblings, bread earners with gloom staring in their eyes! Let them think for a while & visualize what would have been their plight had they encountered similar predicament!

 

So, in conclusion, none of the human beings have any choice when they are born; let human beings live as human beings respecting others right to exist, live, pursue a profession, earn livelihood by fair & equitable means, so long as such a behaviour does not cause any harm, injury, loss or consternation to others, coexisting in this world as human beings, in perfect symbiosis.

 

Regards,

WEDS



From: RTI4Emp <rti4empowerment.owner@gmail.com>
To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, 11 December, 2010 23:45:30
Subject: [rti4empowerment] Poll results for rti4empowerment

Poll results for rti4empowerment

The following rti4empowerment poll is now closed. Here are the final results:

POLL QUESTION: The policy for allowing illegal immigration is under consideration. Views of members of yahoo group rti4empowerment are solicited, for sending a representation to the Prime Minister of India. The question to be considered is whether it is in India's national interest to allow illegal migrants from neighboring countries?

What do you think ?

CHOICES AND RESULTS

- Yes, existing practice should continue,. 0 votes, 0.00%
- No, effective measures should be taken to prevent them, 1 vote,  25.00%
- Any one who criticizes such illegal entry is an "hindu bigot" and should be condemned,  3 votes, 75.00%
- International borders have lost their significance in glogalized environment,  0 votes,  0.00%
- Any other views. ( Please specify by posting a message in yahoo group rti4empowerment.),  0 votes, 0.00%

For more information about this group, please visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rti4empowerment

For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit
http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/forms/general.html

Re: [rti4empowerment] FROM CIC WEBSITE ON VIG-EYE

Dear Mr, Gupta,

I had complained of under valuation of propertis while registering sale * purchase of  immoveable properties, to CVC, CBDT, Prime Minister & Finance Minister. No action initiated yet.
 
WEDS


From: M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in>
To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, 11 December, 2010 19:31:16
Subject: [rti4empowerment] FROM CIC WEBSITE ON VIG-EYE

Upload videos, audios to expose corruption on CVC's 'Vig-Eye'
New Delhi, Dec 9, (PTI):

In a unique move, the Central Vigilance Commission today launched an exclusive website for people to upload videos, audios and lodge complaints exposing acts of corruption in government departments.

According to an anti-corruption watchdog official, Vig-Eye (an acronym for vigilance eye), provides a more user-friendly platform for interface between the CVC and the citizens who may have suffered at the hands of corrupt officials and who want to disclose information about such illegal activities.

"The advantage of Vig-Eye includes simplified process of filing complaints and it will provide authentic identity of the complainant. Vig-Eye would be completely digitised and it will give online access to vigilance information," Central Vigilance Commission P J Thomas said while inaugurating the web portal.

"Efforts at modernising the vigilance framework are underway which include development of new models of preventive vigilance, adoption of risk management approach and aligning the vigilance function with the corporate governance framework," he said.

The CVC said that preventive and punitive approaches to addressing corruption need to complement each other. The Commission has adopted a strategy of leveraging technology and has been persuading the government to adopt e-governance measures.

"The aim is to use technology in activities vulnerable to corruption in order to reduce human intervention," he said. Thomas said that the Commission has undertaken a campaign aimed at creating awareness about corruption and inculcating ethics on good governance. The campaign would help reduce people's tolerance for corruption.

The Commission has also recommended to the government to include ethics education in the school curriculum, Thomas said. Thomas was speaking during a seminar 'Empowering citizens to combat corruption' organised at Vigyan Bhawan here on International Anti-Corruption Day. The seminar was aimed at deliberating and recommending proactive and participative measures to combat corruption.

Introducing the Vig-Eye, Vigilance Commissioner Srikumar said that it will help build up the vision of proactive and predictive vigilance. The VC said that people can use mobile phones and web based technologies to lodge complaints or grievances using mobile phones with a software application specially designed to file complaints.

People can visit CVC's website (www.cvc.nic.in) to access or get more information on Vig-Eye. The CVC acts as an apex anti-corruption statutory body mandated to fight corruption and ensuring probity in public life.

Later, eminent personalities from different walks of life participated in panel discussions on three themes -- engagement of civil society in checking corruption, addressing corruption from the supply side and modernising the vigilance framework.

The concluding session was chaired by former Central Vigilance Commissioner Pratyush Sinha who suggested that the government create an environment conducive to the development and participation of civil society organisations engaged in the fight against corruption and ways to convince and empower the entities who act as the source of bribes.

Besides, he suggested modalities for moving over from a punitive and reactive vigilance regime towards a more proactive, preventive and predictive vigilance. During this Session, the rapporteurs -- R Balakrishnan, Chief Vigilance Officer, Chennai Petroleum Corporation Ltd (CPCL), Arun Singhal, CVO, Gas Authority of India Ltd(GAIL) and T Venkatesh, CVO, National Thermal Power Corporation(NTPC) made presentation on the issues to the Chair.

The Chair made deliberations on the issues and recommendations evolved from each sessions and outlined the priorities for the future action.


[HumJanenge] RTI Unification advisory

[DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE]

ADVISORY 2010/12/002

To all members / moderators
1. [rti_india]
2. [humjanenge]
3. [rti4empowerment]

Circulating emails over the afore mentioned RTI google mailing lists on the following topical subjects shall result in instant revocation of  group membership.

a. DoPT's draft  RTI Rules
b. Digvijay Singh

This advisory is issued on behalf of, and in the interest of, all group members / cityzens as a short term measure to limit volume of group message posts.

RU project coordinator

[rti4empowerment] RTI Unification advisory

[DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE]

ADVISORY 2010/12/002

To all members / moderators
1. [rti_india]
2. [humjanenge]
3. [rti4empowerment]

Circulating emails over the afore mentioned RTI google mailing lists on the following topical subjects shall result in instant revocation of  group membership.

a. DoPT's draft  RTI Rules
b. Digvijay Singh

This advisory is issued on behalf of, and in the interest of, all group members / cityzens as a short term measure to limit volume of group message posts.

RU project coordinator

[rti4empowerment] Poll results for rti4empowerment

Poll results for rti4empowerment

The following rti4empowerment poll is now closed. Here are the final results:

POLL QUESTION: The policy for allowing illegal immigration is under consideration. Views of members of yahoo group rti4empowerment are solicited, for sending a representation to the Prime Minister of India. The question to be considered is whether it is in India's national interest to allow illegal migrants from neighboring countries?

What do you think ?

CHOICES AND RESULTS

- Yes, existing practice should continue,. 0 votes, 0.00%
- No, effective measures should be taken to prevent them, 1 vote,  25.00%
- Any one who criticizes such illegal entry is an "hindu bigot" and should be condemned,  3 votes, 75.00%
- International borders have lost their significance in glogalized environment,  0 votes,  0.00%
- Any other views. ( Please specify by posting a message in yahoo group rti4empowerment.),  0 votes, 0.00%

For more information about this group, please visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rti4empowerment

For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit
http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/forms/general.html

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

>>
When you say that there are many paths to reach the goal, it proves
that you are a Hindu. I am not saying this but the Supreme Cout uses this
as a test for who is a Hindu and who is not. This is 1 test of 3 tests
in the "Tilak test of Hinduism" formulated by Bal Gangadhar Tilak
>>
 
Though, I know that this thread has gone a bit off track, I can not resist but concurring with Sarabjit and Ashok  here.
If I compared religion with politics, Hinduism would equate with democracy. And if I may use my crystal ball (:-)), I feel, Hinduism is heading to achieve, in 21st century what democracy achieved in 20th one..
 
Coming back to starting point of this thread, I think group is on gray ground here. I know that in some forms that we fill in context of senior adminsitrave jobs (not sure if that is true for political positions), religion and cast is required(as opposed to being  optional)  information. In that sense the group is correct in asking for the information. But in a true democracy (where India need evolve to), religion  and cast can not be "required information" and in that context, the group is not on strong footing..

 

Regards,
Devendra Tripathi

 

[PS: I have removed my cell number from my signature as per moderator's instructions]



From: Ashok Chaitanya <ashok_chaitanya@yahoo.co.in>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, December 11, 2010 4:18:51 AM
Subject: RE: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

I have read the various critical comments on Mr. Sarbjit by a number of
esteemed members of this platform. Notwithstanding the same, I would
certainly acknowledge Mr. Sarbjit's quality of arguments. In my view, Mr.
Sarabjeet has put forth the clinching and substantial arguments here.

Ashok Chaitanya

-----Original Message-----
From: humjanenge@googlegroups.com [mailto:humjanenge@googlegroups.com] On
Behalf Of sroy1947
Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 5:24 PM
To: HumJanenge RTI India Right to Information Act 2005
Subject: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Guptaji

When you say that there are many paths to reach the goal, it proves
that
you are a Hindu. I am not saying this but the Supreme Cout uses this
as a test for who is a Hindu and who is not. This is 1 test of 3 tests
in the "Tilak test of Hinduism" formulated by Bal Gangadhar Tilak.

Hinduism is an inclusive religion, others like Islam, Christianity,
Parsi etc
are not - you must be their adherent to the exclusion of all other
religions. ie. a Christan cannot be a Muslim or vice-versa or a Parsi.

Another test laid down by the Supreme Court is if the convert been
accepted into the community. So if say Sonia Gandhi claims to be a
Hindu, has the Hindu community accepted her as such ? Today if
you go into any village with Hindus, you will be asked for your jaat
and paat and gotra. It is normal in Indian tradition. Many people base
their decisions on such factors. What is the gotra of Sonia Gandhi ?
I say she has none ! As Subsrmanian Swamy has written, even her
name is not Sonia.

Sarbajit








On Dec 11, 4:26 pm, "M.K. Gupta" <mkgupta...@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
> Though I was born in the family of a Vaish (Gupta) in the Hindu religion
yet I
> regard myself as Indian first.  I also respect Muslim, Sikh, Christian,
Budha,
> Jainism, Persian and all other religions not mentioned here. The goal of
all the
> religions is one though the ways to reach that goal are different.  I
shall have
> been equally happy if I have been born in some other religion as I believe
in
> one religion i.e. 'Humanity' and in servicing of not only human beings but
also
> other creatures of God.  We don't have any control to take birth in a
particular
> religion and this is decided by God but we can control ourselves by living
in
> harmonious ways with the followers of all other religions.
>
>
> After the hate messages of Mr. R. Singh have been stopped on yahoogroup,
on this
> group, one member is suggesting to revoke the suspension of another sender
of
> hate messages i.e. Mr S D Sharma to invite such messages. Shame on us. Pl.
do
> not test patience of the members.
>


Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Sir

1. Kindly specify exactly where Sarabjit Roy (or are you referring
instead to Rajeshwar Rao ?) has spread hatred, animosity and created
rifts between communities living in harmony. As assured we shall take
the necessary action if google's terms of service or this group's
additional regulations are contravened.

2. As the bare reading of this thread titled "RTI Challenge" shows,
Sarabjit Roy had cited a recent judgment of Punjab & Haryana High
Court directly concerning a substantial question of law on RTI upon a
petition by an IG of Police decided against him concerning a request
for records of Sonia Gandhi's religion.

3) Evidently this is information a great many other citizens (such as
Mr Roy) are interested in securing lawfully under the RTI after
discussion on this group. Mr Roy has formally complained that certain
disruptive members are attempting to derail the discussion by
agitating communal and other non-issues. We are inclined to agree with
him.

PMK

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 9:49 PM, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
>
>
> What about issuing caution to Mr. Sarabjit Rao for trying to spread hatered in the society. Moderators are allowing this wilfully and will be equally liable for this before the law. Such action give rise to the apprehensions that Mr. PMK1504 and Mr. Sarabjit Rao are one and same person.
>
> If such things are not stopped, members may complain to the Delhi Police and other authorities authorsed of taking action.
>
> This is not for the rti related issue of filing an application for knowing the religion of Mrs. Sonia Gandhi but for spreading animosty, creating rift between communities living in peace and harmony.
>
>
> --- On Sat, 11/12/10, PMK1504 <humjanenge.owner@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: PMK1504 <humjanenge.owner@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges
> To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
> Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 9:31 PM
>
> Dear members
>
> This group is titled "Hum Janenge - People's resolve to know".
>
> Our prime focus is on discussion of the following issues pertaining to India
> a) RTI
> b) democracy
> c) accountability
> d) transparency
> e) corruption
>
> Everyone can rest assured that owners / moderators shall intervene
> immediately whenever group regulations are contravened.
>
> Sh Khemani is cautioned not to circuate his mobile number to to group
> members. It is a contravention of regulation 1(j ) which can be read
> on this group's homepage
>
> PMK

Re: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges


UNSUBSCRIBE ME PLS


On Sat, 11 Dec 2010 21:41:32 +0530 wrote
>Dear members



This group is titled "Hum Janenge - People's resolve to know".



Our prime focus is on discussion of the following issues pertaining to India

a) RTI

b) democracy

c) accountability

d) transparency

e) corruption



Everyone can rest assured that owners / moderators shall intervene

immediately whenever group regulations are contravened.



Sh Khemani is cautioned not to circuate his mobile number to to group

members. It is a contravention of regulation 1(j ) which can be read

on this group's homepage



PMK



On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 5:59 PM, bimal khemani

wrote:

>

> Now a days ,we are discussing more on other issues, except RTI

> I think ,moderators of various groups must stop all these misuses.

>

> Bimal Khemani

> RTI activist

> ALIGARH-202001

> INDIA

> Mob:935-972-4625





On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 5:59 PM, bimal khemani

wrote:

>

> Now a days ,we are discussing more on other issues, except RTI

> I think ,moderators of various groups must stop all these misuses.

>

> Bimal Khemani

> RTI activist

> ALIGARH-202001

> INDIA

> Mob:935-972-4625

>




Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

 
What about issuing caution to Mr. Sarabjit Rao for trying to spread hatered in the society. Moderators are allowing this wilfully and will be equally liable for this before the law.  Such action give rise to the apprehensions that Mr. PMK1504 and Mr. Sarabjit Rao are one and same person.
 
If such things are not stopped, members may complain to the Delhi Police and other authorities authorsed of taking action. 
 
This is not for the rti related issue of filing an application for knowing the religion of Mrs. Sonia Gandhi but for spreading animosty, creating rift between communities living in peace and harmony. 
 


--- On Sat, 11/12/10, PMK1504 <humjanenge.owner@gmail.com> wrote:

From: PMK1504 <humjanenge.owner@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 9:31 PM

Dear members

This group is titled "Hum Janenge - People's resolve to know".

Our prime focus is on discussion of the following issues pertaining to India
a) RTI
b) democracy
c) accountability
d) transparency
e) corruption

Everyone can rest assured that owners / moderators shall intervene
immediately whenever group regulations are contravened.

Sh Khemani is cautioned not to circuate his mobile number to to group
members. It is a contravention of regulation 1(j ) which can be read
on this group's homepage

PMK

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 5:59 PM, bimal khemani
<bimal.khemani@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
>
> Now a days , we are discussing more on other issues, except RTI
> I think , moderators of various groups must stop all these misuses.
>
> Bimal Khemani
> RTI activist
> ALIGARH-202001
> INDIA
> Mob:935-972-4625


On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 5:59 PM, bimal khemani
<bimal.khemani@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
>
> Now a days , we are discussing more on other issues, except RTI
> I think , moderators of various groups must stop all these misuses.
>
> Bimal Khemani
> RTI activist
> ALIGARH-202001
> INDIA
> Mob:935-972-4625
>

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear members

This group is titled "Hum Janenge - People's resolve to know".

Our prime focus is on discussion of the following issues pertaining to India
a) RTI
b) democracy
c) accountability
d) transparency
e) corruption

Everyone can rest assured that owners / moderators shall intervene
immediately whenever group regulations are contravened.

Sh Khemani is cautioned not to circuate his mobile number to to group
members. It is a contravention of regulation 1(j ) which can be read
on this group's homepage

PMK

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 5:59 PM, bimal khemani
<bimal.khemani@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
>
> Now a days , we are discussing more on other issues, except RTI
> I think , moderators of various groups must stop all these misuses.
>
> Bimal Khemani
> RTI activist
> ALIGARH-202001
> INDIA
> Mob:935-972-4625


On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 5:59 PM, bimal khemani
<bimal.khemani@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
>
> Now a days , we are discussing more on other issues, except RTI
> I think , moderators of various groups must stop all these misuses.
>
> Bimal Khemani
> RTI activist
> ALIGARH-202001
> INDIA
> Mob:935-972-4625
>

[rti4empowerment] FROM CIC WEBSITE ON VIG-EYE

Upload videos, audios to expose corruption on CVC's 'Vig-Eye'
New Delhi, Dec 9, (PTI):

In a unique move, the Central Vigilance Commission today launched an exclusive website for people to upload videos, audios and lodge complaints exposing acts of corruption in government departments.

According to an anti-corruption watchdog official, Vig-Eye (an acronym for vigilance eye), provides a more user-friendly platform for interface between the CVC and the citizens who may have suffered at the hands of corrupt officials and who want to disclose information about such illegal activities.

"The advantage of Vig-Eye includes simplified process of filing complaints and it will provide authentic identity of the complainant. Vig-Eye would be completely digitised and it will give online access to vigilance information," Central Vigilance Commission P J Thomas said while inaugurating the web portal.

"Efforts at modernising the vigilance framework are underway which include development of new models of preventive vigilance, adoption of risk management approach and aligning the vigilance function with the corporate governance framework," he said.

The CVC said that preventive and punitive approaches to addressing corruption need to complement each other. The Commission has adopted a strategy of leveraging technology and has been persuading the government to adopt e-governance measures.

"The aim is to use technology in activities vulnerable to corruption in order to reduce human intervention," he said. Thomas said that the Commission has undertaken a campaign aimed at creating awareness about corruption and inculcating ethics on good governance. The campaign would help reduce people's tolerance for corruption.

The Commission has also recommended to the government to include ethics education in the school curriculum, Thomas said. Thomas was speaking during a seminar 'Empowering citizens to combat corruption' organised at Vigyan Bhawan here on International Anti-Corruption Day. The seminar was aimed at deliberating and recommending proactive and participative measures to combat corruption.

Introducing the Vig-Eye, Vigilance Commissioner Srikumar said that it will help build up the vision of proactive and predictive vigilance. The VC said that people can use mobile phones and web based technologies to lodge complaints or grievances using mobile phones with a software application specially designed to file complaints.

People can visit CVC's website (www.cvc.nic.in) to access or get more information on Vig-Eye. The CVC acts as an apex anti-corruption statutory body mandated to fight corruption and ensuring probity in public life.

Later, eminent personalities from different walks of life participated in panel discussions on three themes -- engagement of civil society in checking corruption, addressing corruption from the supply side and modernising the vigilance framework.

The concluding session was chaired by former Central Vigilance Commissioner Pratyush Sinha who suggested that the government create an environment conducive to the development and participation of civil society organisations engaged in the fight against corruption and ways to convince and empower the entities who act as the source of bribes.

Besides, he suggested modalities for moving over from a punitive and reactive vigilance regime towards a more proactive, preventive and predictive vigilance. During this Session, the rapporteurs -- R Balakrishnan, Chief Vigilance Officer, Chennai Petroleum Corporation Ltd (CPCL), Arun Singhal, CVO, Gas Authority of India Ltd(GAIL) and T Venkatesh, CVO, National Thermal Power Corporation(NTPC) made presentation on the issues to the Chair.

The Chair made deliberations on the issues and recommendations evolved from each sessions and outlined the priorities for the future action.

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Only Indian no first or last.This group should take care of Secularism/Democracy

--- On Sat, 11/12/10, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 4:56 PM

Though I was born in the family of a Vaish (Gupta) in the Hindu religion yet I regard myself as Indian first.  I also respect Muslim, Sikh, Christian, Budha, Jainism, Persian and all other religions not mentioned here. The goal of all the religions is one though the ways to reach that goal are different.  I shall have been equally happy if I have been born in some other religion as I believe in one religion i.e. 'Humanity' and in servicing of not only human beings but also other creatures of God.  We don't have any control to take birth in a particular religion and this is decided by God but we can control ourselves by living in harmonious ways with the followers of all other religions.

 

After the hate messages of Mr. R. Singh have been stopped on yahoogroup, on this group, one member is suggesting to revoke the suspension of another sender of hate messages i.e. Mr S D Sharma to invite such messages. Shame on us. Pl. do not test patience of the members.




From: sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, 11 December, 2010 2:58:27 PM
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Nikit

Please believe when I say that I understand and agree with the
sentiment behind your message. I also appreciate your usage of starred
terms <smile>

I shall truthfully reply that YES I think the issue of why Sonia
Gandhi's and Rahul Gandhi's religion and caste details as recorded in
PUBLIC Govt records is not accessible in RTI to citizens is a matter
of incredible public concern.

I am not interested in the politics of this. For me all political
parties / politicians are equally unsavoury and corrupt.

The specific reason why I want this information is to test the
integrity / honesty / equity of the RTI delivery system. If this group
which has so many people knowledgeable about RTI cannot get access to
PUBLIC records using RTI then the RTI scheme stands exposed as a
massive fraud. I personally cannot accept an RTI appellate scheme
which says Mr X is entitled to inspect records submitted in
coinfidence by Sarbajit Roy (over my detailed objections) but not that
of Sonia Gandhi (because she appointed me as an Information
Commissioner) which are in any case in the public domain as per
pre-existing law.

Finally, if the discussion here is poor, it is because the good and
honest people choose to keep quiet.

I hope you understand what I am saying here.

Sarbajit

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 2:19 PM, Nikit Abhyankar
<nikit.abhyankar@gmail.com> wrote:
> What the f*** is this supposed to mean Mr. Roy? If you think these issues
> are really more important than everything else that the country is facing -
> I pity you. I am deeply disappointed with the discussions on this group
> lately.
> MODERATORS: PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE ME.
> Nikit Abhyankar
>
> On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 12:04 AM, sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com> wrote:


Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Now a days , we are discussing more on other issues, except RTI
I think , moderators of various groups must stop all these misuses.

Bimal Khemani
RTI activist
ALIGARH-202001
INDIA
Mob:935-972-4625


--- On Sat, 11/12/10, rajeev kumar <yadavrajeev_2005@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: rajeev kumar <yadavrajeev_2005@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 5:45 PM

This is last warning to these communal forces to stop their hate mails failing which i shall be compelled to lodge an F.I.R. against these vested interests and leave no stone unturned to get you convicted. You have spoilt the atmoshphere at the groups, we RTI activist work above caste and community lines.

Regards
Rajeev Yadav
--- On Sat, 11/12/10, sroy1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com> wrote:

From: sroy1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com>
Subject: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges
To: "HumJanenge RTI India Right to Information Act 2005" <HumJanenge@googlegroups.com>
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 5:29 PM

Block reason: This message is above your Auto Block threshold | Approve sender | Approve domain | Boxbe


RE: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

I have read the various critical comments on Mr. Sarbjit by a number of
esteemed members of this platform. Notwithstanding the same, I would
certainly acknowledge Mr. Sarbjit's quality of arguments. In my view, Mr.
Sarabjeet has put forth the clinching and substantial arguments here.

Ashok Chaitanya

-----Original Message-----
From: humjanenge@googlegroups.com [mailto:humjanenge@googlegroups.com] On
Behalf Of sroy1947
Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 5:24 PM
To: HumJanenge RTI India Right to Information Act 2005
Subject: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Guptaji

When you say that there are many paths to reach the goal, it proves
that
you are a Hindu. I am not saying this but the Supreme Cout uses this
as a test for who is a Hindu and who is not. This is 1 test of 3 tests
in the "Tilak test of Hinduism" formulated by Bal Gangadhar Tilak.

Hinduism is an inclusive religion, others like Islam, Christianity,
Parsi etc
are not - you must be their adherent to the exclusion of all other
religions. ie. a Christan cannot be a Muslim or vice-versa or a Parsi.

Another test laid down by the Supreme Court is if the convert been
accepted into the community. So if say Sonia Gandhi claims to be a
Hindu, has the Hindu community accepted her as such ? Today if
you go into any village with Hindus, you will be asked for your jaat
and paat and gotra. It is normal in Indian tradition. Many people base
their decisions on such factors. What is the gotra of Sonia Gandhi ?
I say she has none ! As Subsrmanian Swamy has written, even her
name is not Sonia.

Sarbajit


On Dec 11, 4:26 pm, "M.K. Gupta" <mkgupta...@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
> Though I was born in the family of a Vaish (Gupta) in the Hindu religion
yet I
> regard myself as Indian first. I also respect Muslim, Sikh, Christian,
Budha,
> Jainism, Persian and all other religions not mentioned here. The goal of
all the
> religions is one though the ways to reach that goal are different. I
shall have
> been equally happy if I have been born in some other religion as I believe
in
> one religion i.e. 'Humanity' and in servicing of not only human beings but
also
> other creatures of God. We don't have any control to take birth in a
particular
> religion and this is decided by God but we can control ourselves by living
in
> harmonious ways with the followers of all other religions.
>
>
> After the hate messages of Mr. R. Singh have been stopped on yahoogroup,
on this
> group, one member is suggesting to revoke the suspension of another sender
of
> hate messages i.e. Mr S D Sharma to invite such messages. Shame on us. Pl.
do
> not test patience of the members.
>

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

This is last warning to these communal forces to stop their hate mails failing which i shall be compelled to lodge an F.I.R. against these vested interests and leave no stone unturned to get you convicted. You have spoilt the atmoshphere at the groups, we RTI activist work above caste and community lines.

Regards
Rajeev Yadav
--- On Sat, 11/12/10, sroy1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com> wrote:

From: sroy1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com>
Subject: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges
To: "HumJanenge RTI India Right to Information Act 2005" <HumJanenge@googlegroups.com>
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 5:29 PM

Block reason: This message is above your Auto Block threshold | Approve sender | Approve domain | Boxbe

[HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Guptaji

When you say that there are many paths to reach the goal, it proves
that
you are a Hindu. I am not saying this but the Supreme Cout uses this
as a test for who is a Hindu and who is not. This is 1 test of 3 tests
in the "Tilak test of Hinduism" formulated by Bal Gangadhar Tilak.

Hinduism is an inclusive religion, others like Islam, Christianity,
Parsi etc
are not - you must be their adherent to the exclusion of all other
religions. ie. a Christan cannot be a Muslim or vice-versa or a Parsi.

Another test laid down by the Supreme Court is if the convert been
accepted into the community. So if say Sonia Gandhi claims to be a
Hindu, has the Hindu community accepted her as such ? Today if
you go into any village with Hindus, you will be asked for your jaat
and paat and gotra. It is normal in Indian tradition. Many people base
their decisions on such factors. What is the gotra of Sonia Gandhi ?
I say she has none ! As Subsrmanian Swamy has written, even her
name is not Sonia.

Sarbajit


On Dec 11, 4:26 pm, "M.K. Gupta" <mkgupta...@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
> Though I was born in the family of a Vaish (Gupta) in the Hindu religion yet I
> regard myself as Indian first. I also respect Muslim, Sikh, Christian, Budha,
> Jainism, Persian and all other religions not mentioned here. The goal of all the
> religions is one though the ways to reach that goal are different. I shall have
> been equally happy if I have been born in some other religion as I believe in
> one religion i.e. 'Humanity' and in servicing of not only human beings but also
> other creatures of God. We don't have any control to take birth in a particular
> religion and this is decided by God but we can control ourselves by living in
> harmonious ways with the followers of all other religions.
>
>
> After the hate messages of Mr. R. Singh have been stopped on yahoogroup, on this
> group, one member is suggesting to revoke the suspension of another sender of
> hate messages i.e. Mr S D Sharma to invite such messages. Shame on us. Pl. do
> not test patience of the members.
>

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Though I was born in the family of a Vaish (Gupta) in the Hindu religion yet I regard myself as Indian first.  I also respect Muslim, Sikh, Christian, Budha, Jainism, Persian and all other religions not mentioned here. The goal of all the religions is one though the ways to reach that goal are different.  I shall have been equally happy if I have been born in some other religion as I believe in one religion i.e. 'Humanity' and in servicing of not only human beings but also other creatures of God.  We don't have any control to take birth in a particular religion and this is decided by God but we can control ourselves by living in harmonious ways with the followers of all other religions.

 

After the hate messages of Mr. R. Singh have been stopped on yahoogroup, on this group, one member is suggesting to revoke the suspension of another sender of hate messages i.e. Mr S D Sharma to invite such messages. Shame on us. Pl. do not test patience of the members.




From: sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, 11 December, 2010 2:58:27 PM
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Nikit

Please believe when I say that I understand and agree with the
sentiment behind your message. I also appreciate your usage of starred
terms <smile>

I shall truthfully reply that YES I think the issue of why Sonia
Gandhi's and Rahul Gandhi's religion and caste details as recorded in
PUBLIC Govt records is not accessible in RTI to citizens is a matter
of incredible public concern.

I am not interested in the politics of this. For me all political
parties / politicians are equally unsavoury and corrupt.

The specific reason why I want this information is to test the
integrity / honesty / equity of the RTI delivery system. If this group
which has so many people knowledgeable about RTI cannot get access to
PUBLIC records using RTI then the RTI scheme stands exposed as a
massive fraud. I personally cannot accept an RTI appellate scheme
which says Mr X is entitled to inspect records submitted in
coinfidence by Sarbajit Roy (over my detailed objections) but not that
of Sonia Gandhi (because she appointed me as an Information
Commissioner) which are in any case in the public domain as per
pre-existing law.

Finally, if the discussion here is poor, it is because the good and
honest people choose to keep quiet.

I hope you understand what I am saying here.

Sarbajit

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 2:19 PM, Nikit Abhyankar
<nikit.abhyankar@gmail.com> wrote:
> What the f*** is this supposed to mean Mr. Roy? If you think these issues
> are really more important than everything else that the country is facing -
> I pity you. I am deeply disappointed with the discussions on this group
> lately.
> MODERATORS: PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE ME.
> Nikit Abhyankar
>
> On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 12:04 AM, sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com> wrote:

[HumJanenge] Request legal guidance on culpability of MD in cheating / conspiracy / abetment

Friends:

please give some guidance whether a Managing Director of a company is culpable for the acts of his executives in cheating, conspiracy, abetment, criminal breach of trust, etc.  Any citations, please?

Thanks.
Victor

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Nikit

Please believe when I say that I understand and agree with the
sentiment behind your message. I also appreciate your usage of starred
terms <smile>

I shall truthfully reply that YES I think the issue of why Sonia
Gandhi's and Rahul Gandhi's religion and caste details as recorded in
PUBLIC Govt records is not accessible in RTI to citizens is a matter
of incredible public concern.

I am not interested in the politics of this. For me all political
parties / politicians are equally unsavoury and corrupt.

The specific reason why I want this information is to test the
integrity / honesty / equity of the RTI delivery system. If this group
which has so many people knowledgeable about RTI cannot get access to
PUBLIC records using RTI then the RTI scheme stands exposed as a
massive fraud. I personally cannot accept an RTI appellate scheme
which says Mr X is entitled to inspect records submitted in
coinfidence by Sarbajit Roy (over my detailed objections) but not that
of Sonia Gandhi (because she appointed me as an Information
Commissioner) which are in any case in the public domain as per
pre-existing law.

Finally, if the discussion here is poor, it is because the good and
honest people choose to keep quiet.

I hope you understand what I am saying here.

Sarbajit

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 2:19 PM, Nikit Abhyankar
<nikit.abhyankar@gmail.com> wrote:
> What the f*** is this supposed to mean Mr. Roy? If you think these issues
> are really more important than everything else that the country is facing -
> I pity you. I am deeply disappointed with the discussions on this group
> lately.
> MODERATORS: PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE ME.
> Nikit Abhyankar
>
> On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 12:04 AM, sroy 1947 <sroy1947@gmail.com> wrote:

RE: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

Dear Viewer

Thanks for writing to INDIA TV. This is to inform you that your mail has been forwarded to the concerned producer.

Stay tuned to India TV. Do keep writing to us with your views and suggestions.

Thanks and Regards,

Sheetal

Response Executive.


________________________________

From: humjanenge@googlegroups.com on behalf of sroy 1947
Sent: Sat 12/11/2010 1:34 PM
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Re: RTI challenges

It is clear that the old British tactics of "divide and rule" can
still be applied
in India today.

My challenge is a simple one

1) Sonia Gandhi and her children and their spouses are the de-facto
rulers of India.

2) Members of this family sit in Parliament and shape/ vote on
legislation which affects all of us, including on personal laws.

3) The media makes a big thing out of the fact that they visit and eat
in Dalit households.

In this context every citizen has a right to know

1) What the religion of Members of Parliament like Sonia Gandhi and
Rahul Gandhi is

2) Furthermore, if they belong to a religion which has caste then what
that caste is.

Every Indian citizen has to declare their religion at various
occasions which is information in Govt Records. Every publicly
accessible record concerning the religion and caste of these MPs and
Prime Ministers has been rendered inaccessible or destroyed. I am not
speaking about Census records which are privileged, but documents
which citizens have.a right to inspect at any time.

Let me summarise the material available in public domain on these questions.

1) Feroze Gandhi was a Parsi. He never converted out of Zorastrianism,

2) Indira Gandhi was a Kashmiri Pandit (Hindu). In 1930 she renounced
Hindusim and converted to Adi Dharm religion.

3) Indira Nehru and Feroze Gandhi married under Adi Dharm Vedic rites
at Allahabad and their marriage was registered in Allahabad under
Special Marriage Act 1872. After some objections were raised against
this marriage ("completely illegal marriage") Jahawarlal Nehru
arranged for a Arya Samaj marriage certificate under Arya Marriage
Validation Act 1939 by submitting a memorandum (as father of bride)
claiming that Feroze Gandhi has converted to Hinduism and underwent
suddhikaran. A claim which Feroze Gandhi always denied.

4) It is very well known that Jawaharlal Nehru who had no other legal
heir broke up this marriage and 'kidnapped" Rajiv Gandhi and Sanjay
Gandhi to bring them up and did not
allow Feroze Gandhi to see them. Some investigtors have even claimed
that Nehru hastened
Feroze Gandhi's demise.

5) Rajiv Gandhi married Sonia Gandhi by Vedic rites, and got marriage
registered in Delhi under Special Marriage Act 1954 on basis of
marriage certiifcate issued by Arya Samaj. Until 2007 these papers
were at Patiala House Court New Delhi. In the supporting affidavits it
was written that Rajiv Gandhi's religion as "Adi Dharm" and Sonia
Maino as "Christian-Roman Catholic". This was also entered in certain
diaries maintained by the Marriage Officer. These diaries also
contained the records of numerous other citizens. All these records
have now disappeared.

6) Assuming for a moment that all the above information is true, and
Rajiv Gandhi was a converted Arya Samaji or Adi Dharmi then in terms
of Hindu shastra he has no caste or at best the lowest caste.

7) When Rajiv Gandhi was assassinated, he was cremated at public
expense. Surely the citizens have a right to know why the child of a
Parsi father was cremated at huge public expense instead of being
exposed at a Tower of Silence.

If there is any person here who is competent enough to draft a
"responsible" RTI request to know the religion and caste of Sonia
Gandhi or Rahul Gandhi, please discuss it, or I shall withdraw this
challenge and mark it up as a loss against this group and a win for
me.

Sarbajit

Email India TV