Saturday, January 22, 2011

RE: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

I agree with you
Dr N C Jain
23-1-11
 

Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 10:47:57 +0530
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS
From: sanjscot@yahoo.com
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com

An excellent and crisp poll

QUESTION


I believe that the following politicians are honest, secular and have acted in national interest in their public actions
at least 70% of the time.

A) Prime Minister Dr. ManMohan Singh  (YES / NO)
B) Chairperson UPA (Ms Sonia Gandhi) (YES / NO)
C) Former Prime Minister Sh Atal Bihari Vajpayee (YES NO)
D) Former Home Minister Sh Lal Krishna Advani (YES / NO)

My answers
A) Manmohan Singh - Yes
B) Sonia Gandhi - NO
C) Atal B Vajpai - YES
D) L  K Advani - YES

Sanjeev

Re: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

This is further to my previous email. A member (and co-moderator) has suggested offlist to me that this thread be stopped as it has nothing to do with RTI.

I wish to disagree with my respected colleague by sharing a few observations.

1) The RTI Act mentions that for a democracy, the prerequisite is a well informed citizenry which can hold the government accountable to the governed.

2) My experience of over 30 years of participating democratic processes leads me to conclude that it is the so-called misinformed "good", "educated" person who is the biggest stumbling block to achieving deep and meaningful reform in India. Let me list out the characteristics of this class.

a) They blindly believe what is written in laws, press releases, media, and their personal "heroes". They perpetuate this mess by endlessly circulating this misinformation to other "arm chair" / "internet" warriors.

b) They have brains (physically) but cannot think for themselves or develop their brain to use as a weapon/tool.

c) They have no clear idea of the real cancers in todays society, and limit themselves to discussing petty corruptions / affairs like Adarsh Society, CWG scam, 2G scam etc and cheer themselves in their little self created clubs when a few token/minor victories are "achieved." (tossed to them as scraps to divert them). They feel very happy with the media publicity they sometimes get and bask in their little cozy cocoons of self spun moonlight fabric.

d) They do not utilise properly the tools and chances which their peers have won for them. These hard fought victories of individuals are fleeting and evaporate unless other people take advantage of them and defend them.

e) They cannot tolerate disagreement with their own settled views, or criticism of their chosen heroes.

f) They don't understand that the power of "One" is different from the opinion of the "many" What Rabindranath Tagore summarised by 'ekla chalo re'.

3) Polls like Ashish has posted are vital tools to gauge the potential of this group. Are we wasting our time by giving to this group when it is inefficient and/or unproductive ? Does this group need to be refined further ?.

Let  the fun continue. I shall post my own "vote" in due course.

Sarbajit
Moderator

On Sun, Jan 23, 2011 at 11:45 AM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Group:

This is a MODERATOR INTERVENTION
based on replies to this thread so far.

ISSUES;
1) This topic has the potential to spiral out of control and breach our group's email limit of 300 emails.
2) The "poll" is already vitiated because people have started giving reasons to justify their choices. This will influence subsequent "voters".

REASONING
a) This group exists to further citizens right to express freely and publicly.
b) This googlegroup is hampered by not having a poll section like yahoogroups did.
c) At this group we believe that the say of even 1 citizen is as important as the voice of a "mob".

DECISION
A) Posts to this thread will not count towards 30 email limit. BUT be very formal and civilised in your posts
B) No party propganda is allowed.
C) Cast your "votes" and give your own BRIEF "reasons" (if you so wish).

Sarbajit
Moderator

Re: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

The question was not suitably framed and it seems that the poster has some congress/BJP alliance.

In the present form there is every likely hood that the people will give partisan views.

The reframed question is as under:

QUESTION

politicians

Designation

honest

secular

acted in national interest

Dr. Man Mohan Sing

Prime Minister

YES/NO

YES/NO

%

Ms Sonia Gandhi

Chairperson UPA

YES/NO

YES/NO

%

Sh Atal Bihari Vajpayee

Former Prime Minister

YES/NO

YES/NO

%

Sh Lal Krishna Advani

Former Home Minister

YES/NO

YES/NO

%

 

 

On Sun, Jan 23, 2011 at 11:45 AM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Group:

This is a MODERATOR INTERVENTION
based on replies to this thread so far.

ISSUES;
1) This topic has the potential to spiral out of control and breach our group's email limit of 300 emails.
2) The "poll" is already vitiated because people have started giving reasons to justify their choices. This will influence subsequent "voters".

REASONING
a) This group exists to further citizens right to express freely and publicly.
b) This googlegroup is hampered by not having a poll section like yahoogroups did.
c) At this group we believe that the say of even 1 citizen is as important as the voice of a "mob".

DECISION
A) Posts to this thread will not count towards 30 email limit. BUT be very formal and civilised in your posts
B) No party propganda is allowed.
C) Cast your "votes" and give your own BRIEF "reasons" (if you so wish).

Sarbajit
Moderator



--
Warm Regards

Surendera M. Bhanot
- President, RTI Help & Assistance Forum Chandigarh
- Youth for Human Rights International YHRI - South Asia
- CEO, Avis Software, Chandigarh 
- Convener & Life Member, Consumers Association Chandigarh
- Jt. Secretary, Amateur Judo Association of Chandigarh
- Member, SPACE - Society for Promotion and Conservation of Environment, Chandigarh

No. 3758, Sector 22-D, Chandigarh-160022
Mob: 919-888-810-811
PHONE: 91-172-3013240
FAX: 0871 266 8523 

Mail Me


Re: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

Dear Group:

This is a MODERATOR INTERVENTION
based on replies to this thread so far.

ISSUES;
1) This topic has the potential to spiral out of control and breach our group's email limit of 300 emails.
2) The "poll" is already vitiated because people have started giving reasons to justify their choices. This will influence subsequent "voters".

REASONING
a) This group exists to further citizens right to express freely and publicly.
b) This googlegroup is hampered by not having a poll section like yahoogroups did.
c) At this group we believe that the say of even 1 citizen is as important as the voice of a "mob".

DECISION
A) Posts to this thread will not count towards 30 email limit. BUT be very formal and civilised in your posts
B) No party propganda is allowed.
C) Cast your "votes" and give your own BRIEF "reasons" (if you so wish).

Sarbajit
Moderator

Re: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

Hi,

My answers to all four questions - A to D, are NO, NO, NO, NO! 

My reasons: Honesty is not to be assessed based on whether or not an individual has benefited personally or financially. 

If one is silent on any misdemeanour, it is indicative of acquiescence. This is as much tantamount to dishonesty as is personal involvement in malfeasance. 

Dishonesty need not be confined to financial impropriety. For example, Vajpayee, who like, Manmohan, appears to be personally honest, as far as his own financial matters are concerned, was silent on two occasions when a PM was expected to act. One was during the Godhra riots and the other was when Graham Steins was murdered. His foster son's activities are also in the news. 

Vajpayee did nothing when his election agent was caught violating electoral laws. He did nothing when the news of the Jain money-laundering racket broke out. 

Manmohan presides over the most scam-ridden government in history. How could one classify him, as honest? 

The problem is not only with our politicians. This class all over the world are similar. Human greed is not a peculiarly Indian phenomenon. The difference is that the justice system elsewhere is better developed and public consciousness better equipped to handle political dishonesty. 

The problem is not even one of personal dishonesty of politicians. It is a matter of cultural perceptions. Vajpayee did not see anything wrong with Advani's lie on the Kandahar hijacking. There is very high tolerance regarding moral issues in India. A CM who is bigamist continues in office and no one dares to even mention it! 

Regards,

Mathew     

On Sun, Jan 23, 2011 at 10:39 AM, ashish kumar <ashishkr1965@gmail.com> wrote:
Friends, Fellow members of Humjanenge

Many "patriotic" and secular (Uniform Civil Code etc.) members of this group have voiced a concern that an anti-secular agenda emanating from a coterie running the country (which they call BHARAT) is as important an issue to discuss and engage upon, as say only corruption.

In particular a message from Sh Sant Mathur is interesting

"Its well known that secretively a scandalous communal agenda of
Islamisation/Christianisation of BHARAT is getting followed under the
dictat(mostly indirect) of the top most political functionaries of the
governing Alliance of the nation. Its a shame that its not getting exposed
as corruption is !
spm "

In this context I would request the Learned members of this group to freely express / vote on the following simple query by posting to this group. Please trim all emails and only answer YES or NO.

QUESTION

I believe that the following politicians are honest, secular and have acted in national interest in their public actions
at least 70% of the time.

A) Prime Minister Dr. ManMohan Singh  (YES / NO)
B) Chairperson UPA (Ms Sonia Gandhi) (YES / NO)
C) Former Prime Minister Sh Atal Bihari Vajpayee (YES NO)
D) Former Home Minister Sh Lal Krishna Advani (YES / NO)

Ashish
Stand up and speak out

Re: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

I believe that the following politicians are honest, secular and have acted in national interest in their public actions at least 70% of the time.

A) Prime Minister Dr. ManMohan Singh  (YES / NO)
B) Chairperson UPA (Ms Sonia Gandhi) (YES / NO)
C) Former Prime Minister Sh Atal Bihari Vajpayee (YES NO)
D) Former Home Minister Sh Lal Krishna Advani (YES / NO)

Only Atal Behari Vajpayee is honest and patriotic person. He may not be a secular person but wants UCC which may be a divisive Hindutva tactic. YES

Sonia Gandhi is very dishonest, unsecular and selfish person. She fails on every count. NO

PM Manmohan Singh is a weak, spineless rubber stamp kind of person. Irrespecting his own claimed personal honesty, the PMO is nerve centre for corruption and anti-national activity. He may be secular. NO

BJP's L.K. Advani is Sonia Gandhi of his party. Completely dishonest person, another foreign born and anti-secular Hindutva fascist. Has not spoken out against his own corrupt partymen and governments like Karnataka. NO

sincerely
K Rajeshwar Rao

Re: [HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

An excellent and crisp poll

QUESTION


I believe that the following politicians are honest, secular and have acted in national interest in their public actions
at least 70% of the time.

A) Prime Minister Dr. ManMohan Singh  (YES / NO)
B) Chairperson UPA (Ms Sonia Gandhi) (YES / NO)
C) Former Prime Minister Sh Atal Bihari Vajpayee (YES NO)
D) Former Home Minister Sh Lal Krishna Advani (YES / NO)

My answers
A) Manmohan Singh - Yes
B) Sonia Gandhi - NO
C) Atal B Vajpai - YES
D) L  K Advani - YES

Sanjeev

[HumJanenge] Quick group poll: HONESTY OF POLITICIANS

Friends, Fellow members of Humjanenge

Many "patriotic" and secular (Uniform Civil Code etc.) members of this group have voiced a concern that an anti-secular agenda emanating from a coterie running the country (which they call BHARAT) is as important an issue to discuss and engage upon, as say only corruption.

In particular a message from Sh Sant Mathur is interesting

"Its well known that secretively a scandalous communal agenda of
Islamisation/Christianisation of BHARAT is getting followed under the
dictat(mostly indirect) of the top most political functionaries of the
governing Alliance of the nation. Its a shame that its not getting exposed
as corruption is !
spm "

In this context I would request the Learned members of this group to freely express / vote on the following simple query by posting to this group. Please trim all emails and only answer YES or NO.

QUESTION

I believe that the following politicians are honest, secular and have acted in national interest in their public actions
at least 70% of the time.

A) Prime Minister Dr. ManMohan Singh  (YES / NO)
B) Chairperson UPA (Ms Sonia Gandhi) (YES / NO)
C) Former Prime Minister Sh Atal Bihari Vajpayee (YES NO)
D) Former Home Minister Sh Lal Krishna Advani (YES / NO)

Ashish
Stand up and speak out

Re: [rti4empowerment] Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

After opening the site of google.co.in, please type NAC in search column, u will easily find.  That is what I have undertaken the last night.  If some difficulty in NAC, type full name.

--- On Sat, 22/1/11, Raminder Singh <ramisingh.bbc@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Raminder Singh <ramisingh.bbc@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [rti4empowerment] Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC
To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, 22 January, 2011, 4:59 PM

Dear Mr M K Gupta

Can you provide the exact link to NAC website where the report you forwarded is published. I cannot locate it

Raminder Singh

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 10:10 PM, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
Yes, this has been taken from the website of NAC (National Advisory Council).
Thanks for your interest,
regards,
mkg


Re: [HumJanenge] "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"

Dear Colonel Mandal,

It is true that a few elitist and dynastic families have usurped the nation and installed networks of institutional corruption. Ms Aruna Roy also belongs to this feudal culture and continues the servile lapdog culture in the service of these feudal ruling families. As I have some knowledge for this, I can say with certainty that Aruna Roy is not a Maoist, is not even a soft or overground Maoist/Naxal which she is described as being by media. This class of couriers, brokers and middlemen are Janus faced jackals who play both sides for profit.

Raminder Singh

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 3:15 AM, haridas mandal <acsman123@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
What's going on and on - This is how colonial masters divided us and ruled us for 200 years. They send Christian missionaries and the British Chengish Khans to produce as many ango indians as possible along with forced conversions.They made english compulsory for the elites and the dynastic rulers who are now the brown sahebs in the forms of politicians , Raja of ----, Nawabs of -----, Maharani of ----, Lords and Sirs of---.
Lets not use this site for such mudslinging. Ms Aruna Roy is a respected soul and not a timid soul. Let her live longer for the betterment of this country which is usurped by a few elitists families.

--- On Thu, 20/1/11, Nicholas Santiago <nick.santiargo@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

From: Nicholas Santiago <nick.santiargo@yahoo.co.uk>

Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Thursday, 20 January, 2011, 8:23 PM


Dear Sir,

Unlike Mr SD Sharma, I am not an Indian, a Hindu or Brahman. Like you
I knew Mrs Aruna Roy, in a professional capacity connected with
sponsorship and funding activities.
My 2 pence says that Mrs Roy has many facets to her personality and
the evolving discussion here brings out many seemingly incompatible
aspects of her character and
the dichotomy between the public's perception and the private reality :)

Nicholas Santiago

On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 12:01 PM, Malay Dewanji <malaydewanji@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Mr. S. D. Sharma,
> I have gone through your mail. As far as I know the idea of rai harvesting
> belonged to Mr. Sanjit Bunker Roy and the professional architect called
> Neehar just put it on the paper . It happens everywhere and the credit must
> go to the original thinker.
> However, I do not want any debate with you  regarding this.
>
> But some of languages show that you are a Hindu High caste Brhmyanabadi
> person and therefore, I protest against your statement about Mr. and Mrs
> Roy. I personally know Mrs. Aruna Roy, former IAS and a dedicated Social
> Activist, who relentlessly fought in favour of agricultural labourers and as
> a result of her tireless effort, RTI Act had been passed in India. Though I
> do not believe now in Marxism and Maoism, but I believe that many activities
> of Mr. and Mrs. Roy  are very much helpful to the development and
> empowerment of the poor and oppressed. All the people of India must extend
> full support towards their humanitarian effort.
> With all best wishes.
> Yours sincerely
> Malay Dewanji
> Editor, GANABIKASH
> A Bengali News Magazine.
> On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 7:42 PM, S.D. Sharma <anonsharma@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"
>> http://cms.boloji.com/index.cfm?md=Content&sd=Articles&ArticleID=7756
>>
>> "One Sanjit 'Bunker' Roy was given a prize by the Aga Khan foundation for
>> having developed rainwater harvesting structures. Later investigations by
>> The Week clearly revealed that he had hired a professional architect called
>> Neehar Raina to get the job done. Upon this exposure, Aga Khan Foundation
>> changed its citation to fit in with the known facts! A secularly shameless
>> non-communal Roy, ended up by returning his prize. Bunker Roy's wife Aruna
>> Roy, is a Maoist and has worked closely with AID. Like many who have worked
>> closely with AID in its undeclared mission of national subversion, she too
>> has been awarded a prize by the Ramon Magsaysay Foundation."
>>
>> "AID is a secretive organisation which enjoys the full political support
>> of the UPA Government in New Delhi. It was AID which extended generous
>> financial support to Sandeep Pandey, founder of ASHA and a known Naxalite
>> sympathizer, to undertake a political trip to Pakistan some years ago."
>>
>> " 'Apart from CAIR, a few of the groups that AID associates itself with
>> are ASHA for Education (ASHA), Democratic Youth Federation of India (DYFI),
>> (The Youth Wing of the Communist Party of India-Marxist), and Friends of
>> South Asia (FOSA). Each of these organisations has dubious credentials. And
>> many of the volunteers of organisations like ASHA and FOSA are also
>> volunteers for AID. In many cases, the same group of people is behind
>> multiple organisations with pompous-sounding names and uses them as
>> money-generating schemes. Thus it comes as no surprise to know that Anu
>> Mandavilli, a spokesperson for FOSA, is also an editor AID's monthly
>> newsletter.'"
>
>
> --
> Malay Dewanji
> Hony. General Secretary, LAMP, Kolkata.
> and
> Hony. Secretary General, AIAVA, New Delhi.
> Phone:919830082476
>


Re: [rti4empowerment] Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

Dear Mr M K Gupta

Can you provide the exact link to NAC website where the report you forwarded is published. I cannot locate it

Raminder Singh

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 10:10 PM, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
Yes, this has been taken from the website of NAC (National Advisory Council).
Thanks for your interest,
regards,
mkg

Friday, January 21, 2011

Re: [HumJanenge] SBI worst than Swiss Bank

Friend, you may have to use the RTI appeal of the Central Information commission and not State information commission,  I hope u r taking care of this. regards, dwarakanathdm

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 11:55 AM, LESLIE ALMEIDA <lesals2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
Filed RTI application, in september 2010, to Local Branch State Bank of India
requesting information on names of account holders of which i too am a account holder.
if  know your coustomer ( KYC) complied with, how many accounts have as yet not filed KYC as per reserve bank account, name/address of 1st appellate authority They phoned to say they need some time, after 3 months in December 2010 i again put RTI application asking for same, no response to my querie,nor even given me 1st appeals address, I am of the opinion that this No 1 Nationalised Bank is having maximum Benami accounts and are thus not parting with information. I am now filing 1st appeal ( found SBI 1st appeallate authority on SBI website and will follow up with 2nd appeal if the nedd arises
 
Leslie Almeida


Re: [rti4empowerment] Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

Yes, this has been taken from the website of NAC (National Advisory Council).
Thanks for your interest,
regards,
mkg

--- On Sat, 22/1/11, nilesh suchdev <nilesh.suchdev@gmail.com> wrote:

From: nilesh suchdev <nilesh.suchdev@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [rti4empowerment] Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC
To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, 22 January, 2011, 12:53 AM

these recommendations are in line with the feelings of most RTI-users, and highly welcome. can you please direct me to the source of the information....?

best regards, nilesh

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 10:31 PM, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

 
NEW DELHI: Sonia Gandhi-led National Advisory Council has recommended deletion of some of the RTI rules proposed by the Government, holding they are "legally wrong" while some others may encourage "blackmail" and "murder" of information seekers.


The Government had proposed rules for processing RTI applications. One of them suggested that one application shall relate "only to one subject and shall be limited to 250 words..."


Objecting to the proposed rule, the NAC has said, "This would be introducing an exemption which is not in the Act. It is legally wrong for rules to go beyond the Act. The rule about a single subject will be open to arbitrariness and misuse as it is difficult to define."


The Council has also recommended deletion of another proposed rule which allowed abatement of proceedings before the Information Commission on the death of the appellant, saying such a rule could encourage "murder" of RTI Activists.

"This (abatement of proceedings) could encourage murder of RTI Activists. Besides information sought might often be of interest to others apart from the applicant," it said.


The body objected to "allowing withdrawal" of an appeal during the course of hearing at the Information Commission. It said withdrawal of appeals could become a source of "harassment/blackmail".


Going further on the word limit rule, the NAC has recommended its deletion, saying "limit of number of words is bad in Law, unrealistic and will militate against rural applicants." The council also said there is no evidence that either a subject or word limit are "widespread problem" in the processing of RTI applications.

The council has sent its recommendations to the Department of Personnel and Training which had invited public comments on the proposed rules.


The suggestions for changes in the rules were formulated in a meeting of the NAC working group on Transparency, Accountability and Governance on
December 13, 2010. These recommendations were accessed through an RTI application filed by Subhash Chandra Agrawal.


On the proposal of appointing Chief Executive Officer and Registrar General for Central Information Commission, the NAC has recommended that Information Commissioner should have "freedom to select its staff from among Government Servants or from open market. Also, IC should have the freedom to allocate work and responsibility."


The NAC has suggested that Public Information Officers will have to "personally" bear the cost of "legal representation" during a hearing of appeal or penalty proceedings before the Central information Commission if they chose to send a representative of theirs to present the case.


The Council has said missing documents should not be a criteria while rejecting an appeal or application by the Information Commissions. It has also recommended that information should be sent in such a way that proof or receipt remains with the PIOs. It also recommended charging extra postal charges only when the amount is above Rs 50.




Re: Re: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank

Sir,
i do not know yr rules, so if i did some mistake correct me, yes i know i send a e-mail to yr groop with cc to YG, if that is wrong i appologise for the same

L.Almeida

On Fri, 21 Jan 2011 22:39:22 +0530 wrote
>Kind attention Mr LESLIE

You will surely be knowing that this group expels members who post the same content to RTI4EMPOWERMENT-YG.

You also posted this message to YG and received "0" (zero) replies on that group but 7 messages on this group.


Please choose which group you want to post to in future. Next time we will not be so considerate.

List Owner

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 11:55 AM, LESLIE ALMEIDA wrote:


Filed RTI application, in september 2010, to Local Branch State Bank of India
requesting information on names of account holders of which i too am a account holder.
if  know your coustomer ( KYC) complied with, how many accounts have as yet not filed KYC as per reserve bank account, name/address of 1st appellate authority They phoned to say they need some time, after 3 months in December 2010 i again put RTI application asking for same, no response to my querie,nor even given me 1st appeals address, I am of the opinion that this No 1 Nationalised Bank is having maximum Benami accounts and are thus not parting with information. I am now filing 1st appeal ( found SBI 1st appeallate authority on SBI website and will follow up with 2nd appeal if the nedd arises

 
Leslie Almeida




Re: [rti4empowerment] Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

these recommendations are in line with the feelings of most RTI-users, and highly welcome. can you please direct me to the source of the information....?

best regards, nilesh

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 10:31 PM, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

 
NEW DELHI: Sonia Gandhi-led National Advisory Council has recommended deletion of some of the RTI rules proposed by the Government, holding they are "legally wrong" while some others may encourage "blackmail" and "murder" of information seekers.


The Government had proposed rules for processing RTI applications. One of them suggested that one application shall relate "only to one subject and shall be limited to 250 words..."


Objecting to the proposed rule, the NAC has said, "This would be introducing an exemption which is not in the Act. It is legally wrong for rules to go beyond the Act. The rule about a single subject will be open to arbitrariness and misuse as it is difficult to define."


The Council has also recommended deletion of another proposed rule which allowed abatement of proceedings before the Information Commission on the death of the appellant, saying such a rule could encourage "murder" of RTI Activists.

"This (abatement of proceedings) could encourage murder of RTI Activists. Besides information sought might often be of interest to others apart from the applicant," it said.


The body objected to "allowing withdrawal" of an appeal during the course of hearing at the Information Commission. It said withdrawal of appeals could become a source of "harassment/blackmail".


Going further on the word limit rule, the NAC has recommended its deletion, saying "limit of number of words is bad in Law, unrealistic and will militate against rural applicants." The council also said there is no evidence that either a subject or word limit are "widespread problem" in the processing of RTI applications.

The council has sent its recommendations to the Department of Personnel and Training which had invited public comments on the proposed rules.


The suggestions for changes in the rules were formulated in a meeting of the NAC working group on Transparency, Accountability and Governance on
December 13, 2010. These recommendations were accessed through an RTI application filed by Subhash Chandra Agrawal.


On the proposal of appointing Chief Executive Officer and Registrar General for Central Information Commission, the NAC has recommended that Information Commissioner should have "freedom to select its staff from among Government Servants or from open market. Also, IC should have the freedom to allocate work and responsibility."


The NAC has suggested that Public Information Officers will have to "personally" bear the cost of "legal representation" during a hearing of appeal or penalty proceedings before the Central information Commission if they chose to send a representative of theirs to present the case.


The Council has said missing documents should not be a criteria while rejecting an appeal or application by the Information Commissions. It has also recommended that information should be sent in such a way that proof or receipt remains with the PIOs. It also recommended charging extra postal charges only when the amount is above Rs 50.



[rti4empowerment] Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

Govt proposed RTI rules may encourage blackmail, murder: NAC

 
NEW DELHI: Sonia Gandhi-led National Advisory Council has recommended deletion of some of the RTI rules proposed by the Government, holding they are "legally wrong" while some others may encourage "blackmail" and "murder" of information seekers.


The Government had proposed rules for processing RTI applications. One of them suggested that one application shall relate "only to one subject and shall be limited to 250 words..."


Objecting to the proposed rule, the NAC has said, "This would be introducing an exemption which is not in the Act. It is legally wrong for rules to go beyond the Act. The rule about a single subject will be open to arbitrariness and misuse as it is difficult to define."


The Council has also recommended deletion of another proposed rule which allowed abatement of proceedings before the Information Commission on the death of the appellant, saying such a rule could encourage "murder" of RTI Activists.

"This (abatement of proceedings) could encourage murder of RTI Activists. Besides information sought might often be of interest to others apart from the applicant," it said.


The body objected to "allowing withdrawal" of an appeal during the course of hearing at the Information Commission. It said withdrawal of appeals could become a source of "harassment/blackmail".


Going further on the word limit rule, the NAC has recommended its deletion, saying "limit of number of words is bad in Law, unrealistic and will militate against rural applicants." The council also said there is no evidence that either a subject or word limit are "widespread problem" in the processing of RTI applications.

The council has sent its recommendations to the Department of Personnel and Training which had invited public comments on the proposed rules.


The suggestions for changes in the rules were formulated in a meeting of the NAC working group on Transparency, Accountability and Governance on
December 13, 2010. These recommendations were accessed through an RTI application filed by Subhash Chandra Agrawal.


On the proposal of appointing Chief Executive Officer and Registrar General for Central Information Commission, the NAC has recommended that Information Commissioner should have "freedom to select its staff from among Government Servants or from open market. Also, IC should have the freedom to allocate work and responsibility."


The NAC has suggested that Public Information Officers will have to "personally" bear the cost of "legal representation" during a hearing of appeal or penalty proceedings before the Central information Commission if they chose to send a representative of theirs to present the case.


The Council has said missing documents should not be a criteria while rejecting an appeal or application by the Information Commissions. It has also recommended that information should be sent in such a way that proof or receipt remains with the PIOs. It also recommended charging extra postal charges only when the amount is above Rs 50.


Re: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank

Take yr RTI application to the logical conclusion.  Benami accounts give rise to frauds and such benami accounts themselves are fraud aimed at parking black money and other funds earned by unfair means.

--- On Fri, 21/1/11, LESLIE ALMEIDA <lesals2000@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: LESLIE ALMEIDA <lesals2000@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank
To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
Cc: mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in
Date: Friday, 21 January, 2011, 8:26 PM

Dear Mr Gupta
 
I have asked for only one SBI branch
But if they ignore it there is much motre to hide benami accounts thats why SBI having branches all over the world is Indian's No 1 Bank , after i break the ice ( if SBI does not eliminate me, u will understand that there are many accounts parked in SBI that is worst than Swiss bank. the day that thing comes to light the share market on dalal street of SBI will crash, do you think they will allow it to happen,
 
Rgds
L.Almeida 
 

--- On Fri, 1/21/11, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank
To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, January 21, 2011, 4:54 PM

ADVISORY: There is currently a display bug in Yahoo! Mail that effects forwarded messages, causing such messages to be improperly displayed. Yahoo! is working on a fix. In the mean time, you can switch to Yahoo! Mail Classic (see "Options" menu at top right, choose "Mail Clasic...") to see these messages properly. We apologize for the inconvenience.
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Re: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank

Kind attention Mr LESLIE

You will surely be knowing that this group expels members who post the same content to RTI4EMPOWERMENT-YG.

You also posted this message to YG and received "0" (zero) replies on that group but 7 messages on this group.

Please choose which group you want to post to in future. Next time we will not be so considerate.

List Owner

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 11:55 AM, LESLIE ALMEIDA <lesals2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
Filed RTI application, in september 2010, to Local Branch State Bank of India
requesting information on names of account holders of which i too am a account holder.
if  know your coustomer ( KYC) complied with, how many accounts have as yet not filed KYC as per reserve bank account, name/address of 1st appellate authority They phoned to say they need some time, after 3 months in December 2010 i again put RTI application asking for same, no response to my querie,nor even given me 1st appeals address, I am of the opinion that this No 1 Nationalised Bank is having maximum Benami accounts and are thus not parting with information. I am now filing 1st appeal ( found SBI 1st appeallate authority on SBI website and will follow up with 2nd appeal if the nedd arises
 
Leslie Almeida


Re: [HumJanenge] "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"

Dear Dr JN Sharma

1) This is a group to discuss matters connected to RTI. It is not a
group to work for the betterment or upliftment of men (common or
otherwise)..

2) If you would have read the recent posts to this group, there is an
EXTREMELY SERIOUS issue about how the NAC and its sub-group on RTI
under Ms Aruna Roy has subverted the democratic pubic consultation
process on RTI ACT, specifically the amendments proposed on draft RTI
Rules.

3) Over 200 members of this group have filed comments to DoPT
SUPPORTING the 250 word limit and 1 subject rule. The
NAC/NCPRI/Aruna_Roy_RTI_Circus (which are all one and the same)
compelled DoPT to issue the OM of 27.12.2010 which they alone can
comment on. It is also pertinent that the comments sent by Aruna Roy
to DoPT are half-baked and "work-in-progress". The RTI stakeholders
have a Constitutional Right to be informed by putting into public
domain the actual NAC comments filed by Ms Aruna Roy (who is
handsomely reimbursed by the PMO), instead of only circulating press
releases.

Sarbajit

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 8:48 PM, Dr. Jagnarain Sharma
<dr.jagnarainsharma@gmail.com> wrote:
> I agree with Mr Mathew and join him to say that there are many issues
> to be taken up which are very much necessary for the betterment & for
> upliftment of common man.
> We must refrain ourselves to discuss individual
> personalities, as the need of the hour is TO INVOKE RTI
> Regards to all
> Dr JN Sharma
>
> On 1/20/11, Mathew Thomas <mathew.111938@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Why is this group discussing individual personalities? Could we discuss
>> issues?
>>
>> Does anyone have any facts on issues that Aruna Roy is handling? Does anyone
>> have any differences with her views?
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Mathew
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 3:09 PM, indu prakash singh
>> <indupragya@gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Mr. S D Sharma,
>>>
>>> Your writing about Aruna Roy is totally fallacious. We've known her for
>>> long.
>>>
>>> What you claim is a total rubbish. And how high ever it may go, it lands
>>> only in the dustbin. Pl. stop tarnishing images of people like Aruna Roy.
>>> The entire RTI movement is due to her and MKSS. Have you forgotten this.
>>> i
>>> don't understand your rationale for this diatribe.
>>>
>>> prayers for humility to prevail!
>>>
>>> indu prakash singh
>>>
>>> Website:
>>> www.igsss.org;
>>> www.mynews.in;
>>> www.praxisindia.org;
>>> www.sota.dhamma.org;
>>> www.judicialreforms.org;
>>> www.pardadapardadi.org;
>>> www.gandhiking.ning.com;
>>> www.induprakashsingh.com;
>>> www.citizenjournalistawards.com
>>> http://www.cgnetswara.org/
>>> http://www.frontline.in/stories/20101022272108400.htm
>>>
>>> http://photophilanthropy.org/blogmedia/gallery-posts/in-search-of-a-roof/.
>>>
>>> www.bcfindia.org/Urban%20Poverty%20and%20homelessness.pdf
>>> Commonwealth Games: Poor banished from public spaces, India
>>> *...*<http://www.4to40.com/newsat4/index.asp?p=Poor_banished_from_public_spaces>
>>> http://www.4to40.com/newsat4/index.asp?p=Poor_banished_from_public_spaces
>>>
>>> http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_where-have-the-beggars-in-delhi-gone_1446859
>>>
>>> http://www.hindustantimes.com/Where-have-the-beggars-in-Delhi-gone/Article1-607577.aspx
>>> http://www.hinduonnet.com/2010/01/05/stories/2010010550700200.htm
>>> http://www.hinduonnet.com/fline/fl1923/stories/20021122004703000.htm
>>> http://planningcommission.nic.in/plans/stateplan/sdr_pdf/shdr_del06.pdf
>>>
>>> http://website1.wider.unu.edu/conference/conference-2003-2/conference%202003-2-papers/papers-pdf/Harriss-White%20260303.pdf
>>> http://www.cgnetswara.org/index.php?tag=Subhash
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peFHthxPFz8
>>>
>>> Nelson Mandela: *"Running through the struggle like a golden thread was
>>> the indomitable human spirit and a capacity for self-sacrifice and
>>> discipline."*
>>>
>>> Nelson Mandela : *"Young people are capable, when aroused, of bringing
>>> down towers of oppression and raising the banners of freedom."*
>>> Nelson Mandela : *"No power on earth can stop an oppressed people
>>> dertermined to win their freedom."*
>>> **
>>> Nelson Mandela : *"Goverment violence can do only one thing, and that is
>>> to breed counter violence."*
>>>
>>> **
>>> From self ... :
>>>
>>> Explore yourself, and you will find everyone, in yourself
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 20 January 2011 12:01, Malay Dewanji <malaydewanji@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear Mr. S. D. Sharma,
>>>> I have gone through your mail. As far as I know the idea of rai
>>>> harvesting
>>>> belonged to Mr. Sanjit Bunker Roy and the professional architect called
>>>> Neehar just put it on the paper . It happens everywhere and the credit
>>>> must
>>>> go to the original thinker.
>>>> However, I do not want any debate with you regarding this.
>>>>
>>>> But some of languages show that you are a Hindu High caste Brhmyanabadi
>>>> person and therefore, I protest against your statement about Mr. and Mrs
>>>> Roy. I personally know Mrs. Aruna Roy, former IAS and a dedicated Social
>>>> Activist, who relentlessly fought in favour of agricultural labourers and
>>>> as
>>>> a result of her tireless effort, RTI Act had been passed in India. Though
>>>> I
>>>> do not believe now in Marxism and Maoism, but I believe that many
>>>> activities
>>>> of Mr. and Mrs. Roy are very much helpful to the development and
>>>> empowerment of the poor and oppressed. All the people of India must
>>>> extend
>>>> full support towards their humanitarian effort.
>>>> With all best wishes.
>>>> Yours sincerely
>>>> Malay Dewanji
>>>> Editor, GANABIKASH
>>>> A Bengali News Magazine.
>>>> On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 7:42 PM, S.D. Sharma
>>>> <anonsharma@yahoo.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> *"Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"*
>>>>> http://cms.boloji.com/index.cfm?md=Content&sd=Articles&ArticleID=7756
>>>>>
>>>>> "One Sanjit 'Bunker' Roy was given a prize by the Aga Khan foundation
>>>>> for having developed rainwater harvesting structures. Later
>>>>> investigations
>>>>> by The Week clearly revealed that he had hired a professional architect
>>>>> called Neehar Raina to get the job done. Upon this exposure, Aga Khan
>>>>> Foundation changed its citation to fit in with the known facts! A
>>>>> secularly
>>>>> shameless non-communal Roy, ended up by returning his prize. Bunker
>>>>> Roy's
>>>>> wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist and has worked closely with AID. Like many
>>>>> who
>>>>> have worked closely with AID in its undeclared mission of national
>>>>> subversion, she too has been awarded a prize by the Ramon Magsaysay
>>>>> Foundation."
>>>>>
>>>>> "AID is a secretive organisation which enjoys the full political support
>>>>> of the UPA Government in New Delhi. It was AID which extended generous
>>>>> financial support to Sandeep Pandey, founder of ASHA and a known
>>>>> Naxalite
>>>>> sympathizer, to undertake a political trip to Pakistan some years ago."
>>>>>
>>>>> " 'Apart from CAIR, a few of the groups that AID associates itself with
>>>>> are ASHA for Education (ASHA), Democratic Youth Federation of India
>>>>> (DYFI),
>>>>> (The Youth Wing of the Communist Party of India-Marxist), and Friends of
>>>>> South Asia (FOSA). Each of these organisations has dubious credentials.
>>>>> And
>>>>> many of the volunteers of organisations like ASHA and FOSA are also
>>>>> volunteers for AID. In many cases, the same group of people is behind
>>>>> multiple organisations with pompous-sounding names and uses them as
>>>>> money-generating schemes. Thus it comes as no surprise to know that Anu
>>>>> Mandavilli, a spokesperson for FOSA, is also an editor AID's monthly
>>>>> newsletter.'"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Malay Dewanji
>>>> Hony. General Secretary, LAMP, Kolkata.
>>>> and
>>>> Hony. Secretary General, AIAVA, New Delhi.
>>>> Phone:919830082476
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank

DEAR ALL
Traditional Banks must change their outlook is the need of the hour.
Dr. JN Sharma

On 1/21/11, LESLIE ALMEIDA <lesals2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Filed RTI application, in september 2010, to Local Branch State Bank of
> India
> requesting information on names of account holders of which i too am a
> account holder.
> if know your coustomer ( KYC) complied with, how many accounts have as yet
> not filed KYC as per reserve bank account, name/address of 1st appellate
> authority They phoned to say they need some time, after 3 months in December
> 2010 i again put RTI application asking for same, no response to my
> querie,nor even given me 1st appeals address, I am of the opinion that this
> No 1 Nationalised Bank is having maximum Benami accounts and are thus not
> parting with information. I am now filing 1st appeal ( found SBI 1st
> appeallate authority on SBI website and will follow up with 2nd appeal if
> the nedd arises
>
> Leslie Almeida
>
>
>

Re: [HumJanenge] "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"

I agree with Mr Mathew and join him to say that there are many issues
to be taken up which are very much necessary for the betterment & for
upliftment of common man.
We must refrain ourselves to discuss individual
personalities, as the need of the hour is TO INVOKE RTI
Regards to all
Dr JN Sharma

On 1/20/11, Mathew Thomas <mathew.111938@gmail.com> wrote:
> Why is this group discussing individual personalities? Could we discuss
> issues?
>
> Does anyone have any facts on issues that Aruna Roy is handling? Does anyone
> have any differences with her views?
>
> Regards,
>
> Mathew
>
> On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 3:09 PM, indu prakash singh
> <indupragya@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Mr. S D Sharma,
>>
>> Your writing about Aruna Roy is totally fallacious. We've known her for
>> long.
>>
>> What you claim is a total rubbish. And how high ever it may go, it lands
>> only in the dustbin. Pl. stop tarnishing images of people like Aruna Roy.
>> The entire RTI movement is due to her and MKSS. Have you forgotten this.
>> i
>> don't understand your rationale for this diatribe.
>>
>> prayers for humility to prevail!
>>
>> indu prakash singh
>>
>> Website:
>> www.igsss.org;
>> www.mynews.in;
>> www.praxisindia.org;
>> www.sota.dhamma.org;
>> www.judicialreforms.org;
>> www.pardadapardadi.org;
>> www.gandhiking.ning.com;
>> www.induprakashsingh.com;
>> www.citizenjournalistawards.com
>> http://www.cgnetswara.org/
>> http://www.frontline.in/stories/20101022272108400.htm
>>
>> http://photophilanthropy.org/blogmedia/gallery-posts/in-search-of-a-roof/.
>>
>> www.bcfindia.org/Urban%20Poverty%20and%20homelessness.pdf
>> Commonwealth Games: Poor banished from public spaces, India
>> *...*<http://www.4to40.com/newsat4/index.asp?p=Poor_banished_from_public_spaces>
>> http://www.4to40.com/newsat4/index.asp?p=Poor_banished_from_public_spaces
>>
>> http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_where-have-the-beggars-in-delhi-gone_1446859
>>
>> http://www.hindustantimes.com/Where-have-the-beggars-in-Delhi-gone/Article1-607577.aspx
>> http://www.hinduonnet.com/2010/01/05/stories/2010010550700200.htm
>> http://www.hinduonnet.com/fline/fl1923/stories/20021122004703000.htm
>> http://planningcommission.nic.in/plans/stateplan/sdr_pdf/shdr_del06.pdf
>>
>> http://website1.wider.unu.edu/conference/conference-2003-2/conference%202003-2-papers/papers-pdf/Harriss-White%20260303.pdf
>> http://www.cgnetswara.org/index.php?tag=Subhash
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peFHthxPFz8
>>
>> Nelson Mandela: *"Running through the struggle like a golden thread was
>> the indomitable human spirit and a capacity for self-sacrifice and
>> discipline."*
>>
>> Nelson Mandela : *"Young people are capable, when aroused, of bringing
>> down towers of oppression and raising the banners of freedom."*
>> Nelson Mandela : *"No power on earth can stop an oppressed people
>> dertermined to win their freedom."*
>> **
>> Nelson Mandela : *"Goverment violence can do only one thing, and that is
>> to breed counter violence."*
>>
>> **
>> From self ... :
>>
>> Explore yourself, and you will find everyone, in yourself
>>
>>
>>
>> On 20 January 2011 12:01, Malay Dewanji <malaydewanji@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Mr. S. D. Sharma,
>>> I have gone through your mail. As far as I know the idea of rai
>>> harvesting
>>> belonged to Mr. Sanjit Bunker Roy and the professional architect called
>>> Neehar just put it on the paper . It happens everywhere and the credit
>>> must
>>> go to the original thinker.
>>> However, I do not want any debate with you regarding this.
>>>
>>> But some of languages show that you are a Hindu High caste Brhmyanabadi
>>> person and therefore, I protest against your statement about Mr. and Mrs
>>> Roy. I personally know Mrs. Aruna Roy, former IAS and a dedicated Social
>>> Activist, who relentlessly fought in favour of agricultural labourers and
>>> as
>>> a result of her tireless effort, RTI Act had been passed in India. Though
>>> I
>>> do not believe now in Marxism and Maoism, but I believe that many
>>> activities
>>> of Mr. and Mrs. Roy are very much helpful to the development and
>>> empowerment of the poor and oppressed. All the people of India must
>>> extend
>>> full support towards their humanitarian effort.
>>> With all best wishes.
>>> Yours sincerely
>>> Malay Dewanji
>>> Editor, GANABIKASH
>>> A Bengali News Magazine.
>>> On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 7:42 PM, S.D. Sharma
>>> <anonsharma@yahoo.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> *"Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"*
>>>> http://cms.boloji.com/index.cfm?md=Content&sd=Articles&ArticleID=7756
>>>>
>>>> "One Sanjit 'Bunker' Roy was given a prize by the Aga Khan foundation
>>>> for having developed rainwater harvesting structures. Later
>>>> investigations
>>>> by The Week clearly revealed that he had hired a professional architect
>>>> called Neehar Raina to get the job done. Upon this exposure, Aga Khan
>>>> Foundation changed its citation to fit in with the known facts! A
>>>> secularly
>>>> shameless non-communal Roy, ended up by returning his prize. Bunker
>>>> Roy's
>>>> wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist and has worked closely with AID. Like many
>>>> who
>>>> have worked closely with AID in its undeclared mission of national
>>>> subversion, she too has been awarded a prize by the Ramon Magsaysay
>>>> Foundation."
>>>>
>>>> "AID is a secretive organisation which enjoys the full political support
>>>> of the UPA Government in New Delhi. It was AID which extended generous
>>>> financial support to Sandeep Pandey, founder of ASHA and a known
>>>> Naxalite
>>>> sympathizer, to undertake a political trip to Pakistan some years ago."
>>>>
>>>> " 'Apart from CAIR, a few of the groups that AID associates itself with
>>>> are ASHA for Education (ASHA), Democratic Youth Federation of India
>>>> (DYFI),
>>>> (The Youth Wing of the Communist Party of India-Marxist), and Friends of
>>>> South Asia (FOSA). Each of these organisations has dubious credentials.
>>>> And
>>>> many of the volunteers of organisations like ASHA and FOSA are also
>>>> volunteers for AID. In many cases, the same group of people is behind
>>>> multiple organisations with pompous-sounding names and uses them as
>>>> money-generating schemes. Thus it comes as no surprise to know that Anu
>>>> Mandavilli, a spokesperson for FOSA, is also an editor AID's monthly
>>>> newsletter.'"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Malay Dewanji
>>> Hony. General Secretary, LAMP, Kolkata.
>>> and
>>> Hony. Secretary General, AIAVA, New Delhi.
>>> Phone:919830082476
>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank

Dear Mr Gupta
 
I have asked for only one SBI branch
But if they ignore it there is much motre to hide benami accounts thats why SBI having branches all over the world is Indian's No 1 Bank , after i break the ice ( if SBI does not eliminate me, u will understand that there are many accounts parked in SBI that is worst than Swiss bank. the day that thing comes to light the share market on dalal street of SBI will crash, do you think they will allow it to happen,
 
Rgds
L.Almeida 
 

--- On Fri, 1/21/11, M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: M.K. Gupta <mkgupta100@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: [rti4empowerment] SBI worst than Swiss Bank
To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, January 21, 2011, 4:54 PM

ADVISORY: There is currently a display bug in Yahoo! Mail that effects forwarded messages, causing such messages to be improperly displayed. Yahoo! is working on a fix. In the mean time, you can switch to Yahoo! Mail Classic (see "Options" menu at top right, choose "Mail Clasic...") to see these messages properly. We apologize for the inconvenience.
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Re: [HumJanenge] "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"

Dear Haridas,

Yours is one of the funniest posts I have read all week.

If you read the bio-datas of Bunker Roy or Aruna Roy (freely accessible), the one thing which comes through is that they come from privileged Anglo educated families, studied ENGLISH of all things at prestigious colleges, Doon School, St.Stephens College, are utterly / eminently unqualified in any professional of scientific field which requires brains, and misuse their knowledge of English to write up fancy (and fake) proposals for funding from foreign agencies. In other words they are PROFESSIONAL PARASITES :-)

BTW, I would love to discuss things like this with them but unfortunately they are too timid to face people like us on fora which they can't control .

Sarbajit

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 4:45 PM, haridas mandal <acsman123@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
What's going on and on - This is how colonial masters divided us and ruled us for 200 years. They send Christian missionaries and the British Chengish Khans to produce as many ango indians as possible along with forced conversions.They made english compulsory for the elites and the dynastic rulers who are now the brown sahebs in the forms of politicians , Raja of ----, Nawabs of -----, Maharani of ----, Lords and Sirs of---.
Lets not use this site for such mudslinging. Ms Aruna Roy is a respected soul and not a timid soul. Let her live longer for the betterment of this country which is usurped by a few elitists families.

--- On Thu, 20/1/11, Nicholas Santiago <nick.santiargo@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

From: Nicholas Santiago <nick.santiargo@yahoo.co.uk>

Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Thursday, 20 January, 2011, 8:23 PM


Dear Sir,

Unlike Mr SD Sharma, I am not an Indian, a Hindu or Brahman. Like you
I knew Mrs Aruna Roy, in a professional capacity connected with
sponsorship and funding activities.
My 2 pence says that Mrs Roy has many facets to her personality and
the evolving discussion here brings out many seemingly incompatible
aspects of her character and
the dichotomy between the public's perception and the private reality :)

Nicholas Santiago

On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 12:01 PM, Malay Dewanji <malaydewanji@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Mr. S. D. Sharma,
> I have gone through your mail. As far as I know the idea of rai harvesting
> belonged to Mr. Sanjit Bunker Roy and the professional architect called
> Neehar just put it on the paper . It happens everywhere and the credit must
> go to the original thinker.
> However, I do not want any debate with you  regarding this.
>
> But some of languages show that you are a Hindu High caste Brhmyanabadi
> person and therefore, I protest against your statement about Mr. and Mrs
> Roy. I personally know Mrs. Aruna Roy, former IAS and a dedicated Social
> Activist, who relentlessly fought in favour of agricultural labourers and as
> a result of her tireless effort, RTI Act had been passed in India. Though I
> do not believe now in Marxism and Maoism, but I believe that many activities
> of Mr. and Mrs. Roy  are very much helpful to the development and
> empowerment of the poor and oppressed. All the people of India must extend
> full support towards their humanitarian effort.
> With all best wishes.
> Yours sincerely
> Malay Dewanji
> Editor, GANABIKASH
> A Bengali News Magazine.
> On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 7:42 PM, S.D. Sharma <anonsharma@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> "Bunker Roy's wife Aruna Roy, is a Maoist"
>> http://cms.boloji.com/index.cfm?md=Content&sd=Articles&ArticleID=7756
>>
>> "One Sanjit 'Bunker' Roy was given a prize by the Aga Khan foundation for
>> having developed rainwater harvesting structures. Later investigations by
>> The Week clearly revealed that he had hired a professional architect called
>> Neehar Raina to get the job done. Upon this exposure, Aga Khan Foundation
>> changed its citation to fit in with the known facts! A secularly shameless
>> non-communal Roy, ended up by returning his prize. Bunker Roy's wife Aruna
>> Roy, is a Maoist and has worked closely with AID. Like many who have worked
>> closely with AID in its undeclared mission of national subversion, she too
>> has been awarded a prize by the Ramon Magsaysay Foundation."
>>
>> "AID is a secretive organisation which enjoys the full political support
>> of the UPA Government in New Delhi. It was AID which extended generous
>> financial support to Sandeep Pandey, founder of ASHA and a known Naxalite
>> sympathizer, to undertake a political trip to Pakistan some years ago."
>>
>> " 'Apart from CAIR, a few of the groups that AID associates itself with
>> are ASHA for Education (ASHA), Democratic Youth Federation of India (DYFI),
>> (The Youth Wing of the Communist Party of India-Marxist), and Friends of
>> South Asia (FOSA). Each of these organisations has dubious credentials. And
>> many of the volunteers of organisations like ASHA and FOSA are also
>> volunteers for AID. In many cases, the same group of people is behind
>> multiple organisations with pompous-sounding names and uses them as
>> money-generating schemes. Thus it comes as no surprise to know that Anu
>> Mandavilli, a spokesperson for FOSA, is also an editor AID's monthly
>> newsletter.'"
>
>
> --
> Malay Dewanji
> Hony. General Secretary, LAMP, Kolkata.
> and
> Hony. Secretary General, AIAVA, New Delhi.
> Phone:919830082476
>


Re: Reply: [rti4empowerment] Re: VERY IMPORTANT GROUP ANNOUNCEMENT

Dear WEDS
Thanks for the detailed version of our rights & duties which
are enshrined in our Constitution
Regards
Dr JN Sharma


On 1/18/11, DSouza Wilberious Evanglist <wilevades@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> Dear Gentleman incognito,
>
> Please remember,
>
> I am addressing this letter to you exercising the fundamental right to
> freedom
> of speech & expression guaranteed by the Constitution of Inda to every
> citizen
> of India by Art 19(1)(a).
>
> RTI is a fundamental & Human Right of every citizen of the Secular
> Democratic
> Republic of India.
>
> RTI activist is a self proclaimed designation. The rights of citizens in
> Indian
> democracy are guaranteed by The Constitution of India. To exercise it one
> does
> not need an epaulet as"RTI Activist".
>
> I did not become a member by an act of volition. I began receiving mails of
> knowledge & experience sharing in relation to this fundamental right of RTI
> & I
> began interacting & I enjoy doing so for I consider it a mutually beneficial
> exercise among citizens in relation to this right. I reply to every message
> I
> receive & express my opinion fearlessly if I am prompted to intrinsically.
>
> I am in no way indebted to you nor any citizen is for all citizens of India
> begot this right as a constitutional provision & not benevolence from you.
>
> Whether one remains in this group or interact with this group or is expelled
> from this group one does not cease to exercise ones fundamental & human
> rights
> as these are rights of individual citizens of India & not a grant or gift of
> benevolence from you.
>
> I have always advocated solidarity & coordination between citizens
> exercising
> their rights for mutual benefit & survival too as this exercise involves
> exposure of classified information where vested interests are hurt or
> corruption
> is sought to be exposed which undermines sinister interest of persons who
> are
> deeply entrenched & are working as unpublicised cartel.
>
> This solidarity & coordination envisaged is by not an organisation with
> hegemonic hierarchy but by mere acts of volition & without any political
> contamination.
>
> Your proclamation
>
> Now a few agents of Congress Party are trying to damage the RTI Unification
> process by misusing our group's facility by putting up parallel
> organizations.
>
> is blatantly indicative of your allegiance to some political party that is
> contra Congress party, This indicates that you are not apolitical but
> politically motivated. Som you think behave & conduct yourself as a
> politician.
> You fail to affirm for yourself that you are a citizen first.
>
>
> You have failed to possess conviction into yourself that you are a citizen
> of a
> SOVEREIGN SOCIALIST SECULAR DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC. You have also failed to
> realise
> that it is the people of India who vote a political party or conglamoration
> of
> political parties to govern themself. You fail to realise that " IN A
> DEMOCRACY,
> THE GOVERNMENT IS BY A PEOPLE, OF THE PEOPLE & FOR THAE PEOPLE!
>
> When it is about citizens of India exercising their constitutional rights
> where
> is the locus standi for a political party such as Congress or any other
> Contra
> Congress party to which you owe allegiance to to declare that some agents of
> Congress are undermining RTI activists Unification? What is the moral right
> you
> have to talk aboit RTI Acivist unification when the term RTI Activist itself
> is
> a misconception, illusion & a mirage? It is axiomatic that that RTI is a
> Constitutional Right of every Citizen of India. Neither Congress party is
> has
> showered it as a blessing on Citizens of India nor any other contra Congress
> party.
>
>
> You should be aware & reaffirm to yourself that political parties exist by
> implicit mandate of the citizens of India by Art.19(c) of the Comnstitytion
> of
> India. It is the people of India who gave India the Constitution & not
> Congress
> or any other contra Congress party. Read preamble tjhat is reproduced!
>
> WE, THE PEOPLE OF INDIA, having solemnly resolved to constitute India into a
> 1[SOVEREIGN SOCIALIST SECULAR DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC] and to secure to all its
> citizens:
> JUSTICE, social, economic and political;
> LIBERTY of thought, expression, belief, faith and worship;
> EQUALITY of status and of opportunity; and to promote among them all
> FRATERNITY assuring the dignity of the individual and the 2[unity and
> integrity
> of the Nation];
> IN OUR CONSTITUENT ASSEMBLY this twentysixth day of November, 1949, do
> HEREBY
> ADOPT, ENACT AND GIVE TO OURSELVES THIS CONSTITUTION.
>
> You claim yourself to be owner of rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com.
>
> Let me indicate to you every citizen is free to exercise his/her fundamental
> right. One need not walk into your ownership as a guest/tenant or member.
> The
> rights of citizens of India are not incumbant upon one being in your group
> or
> not.
>
> You claim yourself as self proclaimed crusader for RTI activist unity as if
> others are working contra to it despite the fact ab initio concept of RTI
> activist does not exist. NONE KNOWS WHO YOU ARE! YOU WORK INCOGNITO! MANY A
> CITIZEN INTERACTERS SOUGHT TO KNOW YOUR IDENTITY BUT YOU HAVE DENIED IT TO
> THEM
> OR ANYONE ELSE! EVEN I DO NOT KNOW WHO YOU ARE YOU PROVIDE THE IMPRESSION
> THAT
> YOU ARE A SUBTERRANIAN GROUP HEAD E.G. AS THE CHE GUERAS! WHY DO YOU HAVE TO
> BEHAVE AS SUCH! IF YOU HAVE NOTHING TO CONCEAL, IF TOU ARE HONEST, TRUTHFUL
> THERE IS NO NECESSITY TO BE ONE IN MASQUERADE!
>
> So do not covey such diktats
>
> AND I SHALL BE WITH YOU!
>
> Regards,
> WEDS
> To all esteemed members of RTI4EMPOWERMENT group.
>
> This is to repeat that this group is part of RTI Unity project. Nowadays
> many
> people are asking for Unity between RTI activist. The list owners of all
> participating groups in RTI unity effort had foreseen this development 6
> months
> ago. Now a few agents of Congress Party are trying to damage the RTI
> Unification
> process by misusing our group's facility by putting up parallel
> organizations.
> These persons are also violating group regulations by cross-posting their
> messages to many individuals and rti-egroups without any discrimination.
>
> So as list owner, I must expel / purge some disruptive members. I am also
> repeating the additional rule for this group.
>
> "ANY MEMBER OF THIS GROUP WHO POSTS ANY SUBSTANTIVE MESSAGE WHATSOEVER TO
> RTI4EMPOWERMENT@YAHOOGROUPS WILL BE EXPELLED WITHOUT NOTICE FROM THIS
> GROUP."
>
> List Owner
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: RTI4Emp <rti4empowerment.owner@gmail.com>
> To: rti4empowerment@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Tue, 18 January, 2011 17:48:14
> Subject: [rti4empowerment] Re: VERY IMPORTANT GROUP ANNOUNCEMENT
> , Neither you are empowered nor you ahve any locus standi. If you wish to
> exercise your rights in consonance with other citizens do so with selfless
> dedication, honesty & integrity. NOT WITH HEGEMONY OR POLITICISED UNITY!
> On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 9:58 PM, RTI4Emp <rti4empowerment.owner@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> To all esteemed members of RTI4EMPOWERMENT group.
>>
>>We apologize that we have not been able to interact with group members as
>> much
>>as other owners and moderators of RTI googlegroups have been doing.
>>
>>PLEASE NOTE:
>>
>>(1) This group is a member of RTI UNIFICATION ("RU") project, which
>> comprises
>>the following other groups
>>
>>(a) rti_india@yahoogroups
>>(b) rti_india@googlegroups
>>(c) humjanenge@googlegroups
>>
>>(2 All rules and regulations applicable to RTI UNIFICATION project also
>> apply
>>here. These are published on webpage of HumJanenge group
>>http://groups.google.com/group/humjanenge/
>>
>>3) Please do not repeat messages here which are posted to other RU groups,
>> or
>>attempt to contact our members outside of this group.
>>Violation will lead to expulsion from the group.
>>
>>4) In addition to the general RU rules, there is an additional rule for
>> this
>>group which will be strictly implemented.
>>
>>ANY MEMBER OF THIS GROUP WHO POSTS ANY SUBSTANTIVE MESSAGE WHATSOEVER TO
>>RTI4EMPOWERMENT@YAHOOGROUPS WILL BE EXPELLED WITHOUT NOTICE FROM THIS
>> GROUP.
>>
>>5) In conclusion, we clarify that Mr. Dhirendra Krishna is not connected
>> with
>>the affairs of this group.
>>
>>List Owner
>>
>
>
>
>