Re: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?

Dear Sri Chauhan 

( or is it just Chauhan in Sainik Sangh style of address )

Kindly note that your rather unique views of history is not shared by other learned authors of armed forces .

Air Marshl Nehra in his book ' Miltary Ethos of Hinduism' , had opined that abnormal pacifism is not a Hindu concept . It was probably imported from Jain or more likely Buddhism .

In fact Ashok emerges as villian in this analysis as he destroyed Mairayan empire by his renunciation and pacifism .

He goes on to add that Hindus were not cowards . They repeatedly fought to death but lost due to inferior war technology / Strategy . While Islam totally destroyed Egypt and Persian culture . It was Hindu cultural and Military resistance that saved our culture .

But by the way we never succeeded in defeating even Pakistan a much smaller country but for assymetric war of 1971.

Bravery ceased to be a passport to prosperity as hunting men settled in agriculture .

The evolution of agrigarian society recognized the limited but very vital need of bravery and thus the VIP treatment to armed forces .

But it is not that armed forces are custodian of human knowledge . 

Sent from my iPhone

On 09-Feb-2013, at 9:46 PM, "Sainik Sangh" <gs@sainiksangh.org> wrote:

Manmohan

These are good thoughts for introspection but Manmohan overly charged with emotions rightly too . I am sure many in this majority Hindu landmass must have pondered similarly  since Delhi was sacked in 1192 and failed to reverse the course; instead got deeper into subservience to any odd and sundry too  . In fact the Hindu identity is identified with submission and opportunism not only by reputation but  testimony ! To any social scientist the weakness of it is endemic in its centrality of the individual !It is an escapist and evasive way of life .Hindu would want someone else to do his job for him!  Study how this affliction was rectified by Ashok IN WHOM WE HAVE THE ANSWER . But  we drop him by the way side in our daily chores ! or take the Gita  it has the answers but we reject these unable to qualify . Just take the relevant tenets of Gita and make out a chart to test how many if not all are violated  by Hindus  We cannot become a State or a modern nation  by espousing a wish list based on an indefinable   and failed identity !All this talk of Vedas is sheer diversion with an ulterior aim. You have read history  we were never A Hindu nation! The word Hindu never existed prior to 7^th Century innovated by Arabs and taken over by Greeks ! It's of Christian usage  Chandrgupta was not a Hindu. We have thousands of manuscripts and none speaks  of Hindu ! HISTORICALLY our problems are  a creation of the priestly class  ! It is the temple versus the State conflict that disarmed the people . No fault of the invaders ! Tell me one instance in human history where a weak could weld a nation and did not attract a stronger adversary to aggression! It is simply a battle of readiness ! No Gods specially speechless ones as ours who can be manipulated by wealth !The life to our deities which the priest was  assigned  to tend and enliven as it were with mystical powers came from monarchs ! Just like it did in Greek and Roman polytheism . Our  last example was the monarchy of Nepal . Perhaps a better example is the monarchy of THAILAND  where much  of what was essence of our polytheism is still retained with good and for good !The King is the Commander in Chief and not a silly politician planted through devious  manipulations !Now you cannot cite   one example in modern history where religion was the basis of making a  nation least a weak and porous one without codes ! We have to look to a different answer to achieve  your dream not by reinforcing failures ! Let's not bluff and deceive ourselves with myopic vision .Who are we accusing of failures  and collapse of virtues if not one camp which carries the placard Hindu blaming the other carrying the placard of Secularism but still Hindu  !The Hindu has innumerous faces !  Hinduism  is defunct because it does not have an inbuilt military component as Islam has ! IN OUR POLYTHEIRSM TOO THIS WAS PROVIDED BY MONARCHS .  Islam  was overrun by the mullah and the faith became notoriously anarchist an antipathy to welding a modern state . But where Islam was freed  of the mullah the best example Turkey it led to welding a nation. Mullah, pandit , padre granthi etc  are the bane of human society . So where is the answer? In a  socio economic formula NOT Hinduatva ! We don't want to be ruled by money in garb of fraudulent  Gods ! How can a progressive person even think of yogic teachers, sooth Sayers   and tooth paste  manufactures giving Stately  light of governance ! Only stupid flock to these imposters  Read how GERMANY BECAME A POWER –SCIENCE TECHNOLOGY –LEARNING –PHYSICAL  FITNESS CLEANLINESS –PRECISION IN DOING THINGS NOT SELF GRATIFICATION,  LOVE FOR TRUTH  VIBRANT YOUTH ORDER AND DISCIPLINE  GERMAN  NOT CHRISTIAN PRIDE !

HOW ASHOK BECAME THE WORLDS BEST EMPEROR WITH A MIGHTY EMPIRE WHERE 6 ENGLANDS COULD BE FIT   EXACTLY THE SAME WAY ! AND BY SHOWING THE BRAHMIN WHERE HIS WRIT MUST STOP – DHARMA –EXACTLY WHAT HE APELT  CODES FOR  CITIZENS  AS IN GITA –DUTY TRUTH AND LOYALTY – NOT SELF ! If we were to judge Gen VK Singh on tenets of Gita he would SALL BY THE WAY SIDE AS HE HAS ! If he set out to mend the health of his institution ( which threw him up) that was a pledge he cannot turn round and take to improving his own health  a volte face ! This is taking advantage of the moment with an eye of profits- a Hindu PRACTICE  to my mind  proscribed in the Gita  and by Ashok's  tenets

Lets come down against any movement that spells  subterfuge in pursuit of brazen power through rabble from streets fed on fuel of ignorance and lies – and doles worst bringing RAM too onto the street and then abandoning him! . Look for a  nationalist route !  If you have nationalism Mr Modi and his mascot  Dr Tagodia  WOULD HAVE TO SERVE  A YEAR ATLEAST IN LINE WITH MEN TO QUALIFY FOR A SEAT IN THE LOK SABHA . Up to you to think of other designs of national service and relax the criteria  . Profiteering by big business and privatization of democracy would have to cease . Loot by religious dens and self styled GODS would have to cease . There would be no need for seeking peace through their advise as society would then be peaceful!  Prosperity would have to be distributed according to value of work No wealth by merely amassing by manipulations on cell phones ! No pawning of sovereignty  to keep others happy  ! And so on Then Jeltly cannot make money fighting law suits on behalf of tobacco companies  in court for giving cancer to the poor! Poor Jetly! And so with Mulayam Singh too and all the Congress mascots ! DIGVIJAYA SINGH WOULD HAVE TO BE SENT TO A REFORMATORY TO LEARTN WHAT IS PRIDE !

Sorry I am in  a hurry . Mull over it . Just returned from our GC meeting . Am going to Mumbai for 10 days but will be on net !

THOUGHTS

MANMOHAN 13 feb is the world radio day ! A day of science Pity we have no event for this even PAK HAS ! We are busy otherwise any way!

Best 73s

 

From: manmohan kumar [mailto:mohan26@hotmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2013 3:48 PM
To: indiaresists@lists.riseup.net; kptuli@yahoo.com; rajiv_upadhyay2003@yahoo.com; Sainik sangh
Subject: RE: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?

 

Dear Gen Chauhan,

Came across this by Preeti Nair which is quite an eyeopener for me;
Have we ever thought why are we Indians the most accommodating, least aggressive & perhaps the most defensive lot ?? Umpteen times we've been attacked, invaded & conquered, be it at the hands of Mughals, the Portuguese, the British or the likes of the Ghaznis. Everyone has annihilated our nation mercilessly, looted us of all or wealth & have ruled over us bringing our nation down on its knees from once being the most flourishing country, the so called "Golden Bird"of ancient times. Why have we succumbed to these invasions most of the times, not retaliating the way we should have done! Except for a few warriors like Prithviraj Chouhan, Shivaji, Porus or Tipu Sultan, who fought bravely, we have mostly succumbed to the invaders, when we had the power to be a Prithvi, Shivaji or a Tipu, individually or collectively. Even now, with neighboring countries attacking us in different ways & spreading their vicious tentacles, always ready to grab us in their jaws, we overlook it & going a step further, we extend an olive leaf to them, very well knowing that they will be back-biting us one day or the other....
Are we a nation of cowards ?? No.....not at all. But then where has all the valor gone from us? In our mind somewhere, deep down, there is an unknown fear.... which is genetic within us, an in-born anxiety....But why, what could be the reason behind this??.....While reading Mahabharata sometime ago, this thought suddenly struck my mind....was it the battle of Mahabharata that wiped out all the warriors & their families completely from this land of warriors?? Is it the fear of another such blood-shed that makes us defensive rather than fighting back ? Yes, I think, perhaps... that could be the reason. The gruesome battle of Mahabharata has left an indelible mark on the psyche of the Indians - born & even unborn, for many more thousand years or maybe forever....The warriors have all been decimated from this land & what is left behind is the fear which is entwined within all of us unknowingly ; which has with time, become an inseparable & distinct trait of ours. And we have to live with this inborn trait whether we like it or not because that is what makes the Indians of the post Mahabharata age !! The violent streaks that we are witnessing in today's India may also be perhaps an out-pour of that suppressed fear buried with us by birth. The reason behind is that, its always the weak who display such a behavior. Most often it is the physically weak who gets targeted and attacked by a mentally weak oppressor. The oppressor does so to prove his "strength" and more than proving a point to others, it's a point that they want to drive home within, to satisfy their own hollow & spineless selves !! So although Lord Krishna played a key role in the onset of battle of Mahabharata to administer justice for the Pancha- Pandavas, but that destruction resulted in the uprooting of valour & positive aggression from an entire Indian race ; & in turn sowed the seed of eternal fear, timidity & defensive Indians for generations to come.......

With Warm Wishes,

 

Manmohan Kumar

 

---

From: gs@sainiksangh.org
To: kptuli@yahoo.com; rajiv_upadhyay2003@yahoo.com; indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 18:49:51 +0530
Subject: RE: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?

WHAT PIPE DREAMING BY EITHER PAID AGENTS OUT FOR MISCHIEF OR SIMPLY  DUMB INTELLECTUALS  OR  UNOCCUPIED KEYBOARD LOVERS AND  HAVE  NO CONSTRUCTIVE MIND OR JUST DAY DREAMERS

FIRST WHEN WAS THERE EVER A 'HINDU '  NATION IN HUMAN HISTORY? THERE WAS A MAURYAN EMPIRE , MARATHA NATION , RAJPUT  KINGDOMS BUT YET NO NATION, THE MOGHUL EMPIRE  AND NO MORE  OF COURSE THE CHRISTIAN BRITISH EMPIRE . THE BULK OF WHAT ARE CALLED HINDUS WERE JUST  MENIAL SERVANTS , UNTOUCHABLES , PETTY TRADERS , WORKERS, FARMERS  , BOOK KEEPERS , JEWELERS , REST LOOTERS MARAUDERS ETC  AND TEMPLE PRIESTS . NOW HAVING BEEN CHRISTENED INTO WESTERN STYLE DEMOCRACY WHAT GREAT ENGINE OF POWER AND WISDOM  HAVE HINDUS BECOME? WHEN TWO HINDUS  ARE NOT SIMILAR  , NOR LOOK ALIKE , NOR SPEAK THE SAME LANGUAGE  NOR TRUST EACH OTHER, NOR  HAVE ANY STAMP OF THEIR OWN- HAVE NO LANGUAGE THE MAIN DISTINCTION OF A NATION –NO LEADER ( DON'T SAY THAT TILAKDHARI MODI OR TAGODIA ARE LEADERS) NO FLAG ! SO I DO NOT KNOW TO WHAT SPECIS OF HUMANS  YOU ARE REFERING TO? THE ONLY THOUGHT ONE COULD HAVE OF THIS NATURE WAS IN THE MONARCHY OF NEPAL THAT WAS A HINDU NATION THE LAST ONE .

NEXT YOU CANNOT RUN THIS NATION WHICH IS 80% HINDUS HOW CAN YLOU RUN A 100% ONE?

ANDS WHO MADE ALL THE MESS YOU ARE SO FED UP WITH IF NOGT ONLY HINDUS ?   WASN'T GANDHI A HINDU, NEHRU TOO, SHASHTRI TOO, ATAL BIHARI TOO ETC ETC .

WHY DO YOU KEEP BLAMING NEHRU HE IS DEAD WHAT DID YOU DO AFTER HIM?

AND WHAT IS THIS GIMMICK INDIA RESISTS RESISTS WHAT   ?

 A  PEOPLE USED TO BEING SLAVES WILL REMAIN SO HOWEVER  COSMETIC CHANGES THEY MAY ACQUIRE UNLESS THEY OVERTHROW THEIR MASTER . THE TRUTH IS IF THE MASTER HANDS OVER THE KEYS OF HIS ESTATE FOR SAFE KEEPING AND HE MAKES A RETREAT THAT DLOESNT CHANGE THE SLAVE ! THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WE ARE SUFFERING FROM WHICH MAKES   HINDUS A SUBMISSIVE AND EVASSIVE CONGREGATION WITH LITTLE  MAKINGS OF A NATION!

A  NATIONALIST            

 

From: indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net [mailto:indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net] On Behalf Of krishan tuli
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2013 9:59 AM
To: rajiv upadhyay; indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?

 

BECAUSE OF LACK OF VISION ON PART OF NEHRU WE ARE STUCH WITH LIFE-LONG NATIONAL PROBLEMS  LIKE PARTITION OF COUNTRY,  LIFE-LONG KASHMIR ISSUE, LIFE-LONG CHINA ENMITY,  LACK OF NATIONAL LANGUAGE,  PERMANENT ESTABLSHED OCCUPATION OF GOVT CONTROL BY NEHRU FAMILY  ETC ETC  ETC

 

From: rajiv upadhyay <rajiv_upadhyay2003@yahoo.com>
To: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net" <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2013 7:59 AM
Subject: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?

 

Sir ,

Why not actively and democratically seek an amendment in constitution . It may materialise slowly but certainly. 

 

From: Babubhai Vaghela <vaghelabd@yahoo.com>
To: indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2013 10:26 AM
Subject: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?

Dear All, At times I wonder as to why Hindus not create and setup
altogather a new Nation called HINDUSTAN somewhere in this vast planet
Earth? With warm regards,

--
(Babubhai Vaghela)
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