Saturday, December 8, 2012

Re: [IAC++] A new political set up for India - A party less democratic sysem

It is an excellent idea. But like the mice belling the cat the problem is only in its implementation.  Like the cat is never going to allow being belled, the people in power will never permit such a system to be brought into force. Any mass movement must necessarily be led by an individual and the probability of such an individual turning out to be a Robespierre is always very high. Historically, all over the world, changes in style of governance have always happened through violent struggle of discontented people and there is only one example of peaceful Gandhian movement in hundreds of years of world history

Today, we have the seeds of another peaceful mass movement in Arvind Kejriwal's AAP. A lot of dissenting voices are out to derail the movement and squash it out of existence, partly due to inertia of the existing systems and partly due to the self interest of the powerful. It is up to the sane voices to ensure that these seeds grow into trees and expand into a forest. Or keep on waiting for the perfect movement to germinate which in my opinion is an unrealistic expectation

Nandhu    

On 8 December 2012 22:19, Vidyut Kale <wide.aware@gmail.com> wrote:
I had a similar idea a few years back. Got reply along the lines of: "It is not possible. It is too sensible. There is no provision of gaining the upper hand. Everyone will have to be equal. Can't allow that."

Vidyut

On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 11:22 AM, Israel Jayakaran <israel@jayakaran.com> wrote:
Dear All,
 
         Democacy is good but it could be misused so much so that the majoirty decision (A hall markof democracy) need not be always correct.It all depends on the quality and character of
the MPs/MLAs who vote.  If we have a collection of selfish and money minded  members, you can't get a  decision in favour of the people. In such a scenario, any majority decision would be in the interest of the voting members. So, the caliber of the elected members matter a lot.If the voting members are  inherently bad and self oriented,  we will get only a bad majority decision which woud be in  favour of the members and not in favour of the people who elected them.  So, is the majority decsion always good?    
 
        In our present democratic set up, anyLallu, Panju could stand for elections regardless of his/her competence.  All one needs to win an election is 'money'. Presently,  only a multi millionnaire could thinkof fighting the elections.  What kind of democracy is this?
 
        I still recall that in 1940's and early 50's, the elected members were very simple and moved with the people freely, asking them about their problems and they went all out  to solve their problems.  Not any more.  Once elected, an MP becomes special human being;  he is inaccessible;  he wouldn't like to talk with you. (Perhaps, you can if you offer him a few thousands).  He is in the seat of power for himself  and not for you and me.
 
        My hard thinking brought one point clear to my mind.        '' The high cost of our elections is the villain of all troubles.; a person spends tons of money to get elected and once elelcted,he gathers more money for the next elections."  In sch a scenario, do you expect an ordinary pensioner to stand for elections, but mind you he is absolutely a top class man on administration and a born leader. But all these are useless in the election context.
 
         The next villain  is the party type of democracy.  What kinds of candidates the party heads put up for elections?  His winning ability;  all other qualities get pushed to the backgound. Do you expect any kind of quality and competence from such elected goons?
 
 
          Dont you wish that  we had a system whereof only the most competent people stand for elections; those who have some achievemns to their credit and are in a position to give and they don't have to spend a paise on elections?  Even such persons will have to be requested to stand for election by  selec ion committee.
 
          Almost a dream, you would sy.  And  yet it is possible to have such a system within the present democratic framework.  And yet, all the riff raffs would stand barred from the hustings.  It is possible, friend.  All we have to do is to work on its introduction .  Please read my article at the attachment, which spells out such a system and is titled: A party less democratic set up for India .   
 
 
         I would welcome your comments on the article.
 
                                                                                 Israel Jayakaran, Colonel (Retd), signasls, veteran, Chennai
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, December 07, 2012 7:30 PM
Subject: Re: [IAC++] A new political set up for India.


      Dear Sir,
      According to me the main culprit for our current pitiable condition is Democracy. Please note that Democracy generates (imposed) Competition amongst people. The Competition being for Power, it is very intense and therefore creates conflicts in minds. This create chasm between various groups of people. The situation in other (Democratically functioning) countries is not much different. (People are neither happy nor contented). Then the game of bribing the voters does not take long to commence. This really initiated corruption in high places that we want to finish. So really we must change the system of our State functioning.
      What Mr Sarabjitsaheb says is true. In the Democracy good and upright people may not like to contest since they are not that popular and in election, popularity of the candidates is under test and nothing else, isn't it? 
      I am attaching my write up on Democracy. You may understand my point of view little better when you go through it. I am attaching it. Kindly let us have comments in order to develop it still further for our use.
      With regards to all,
      ------Mukund Apte

On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 6:18 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Col Jayakaran

We really appreciate the trouble you are taking in the prime of your life to think of saving the nation.

My own model however, gives me a quite different output.

1) My model says that honest, intelligent people do not get elected to public office. If a new party puts up 542 such candidates, they would be lucky to win even 10 seats.

2) My model says that the more corrupt the party which is elected the better the improvements in life for the average middle-class urban citizen.

3)  I dont think that voters are as fed up with the BJP AND the Congress as you make out. I think India is still essentially a 2 party system (and not necessarily the Congress and the BJP only)
For eg. in TN it wud be DMK versus ADMK. In UP the SP versus BSP.  In Punjab the Congress versus Akalis. In J&K the NC versus PDP etc. and so on.

4) What is happening is that the Left seems to be shrinking politically as are the Big 2 parties also.

5) Insofar as AAP is concerned, it is pretty clear it is an RSS operation to transfer the RSS vote bank out of BJP into "winnable" rebels in specific seats so that if the votes break in a certain way the RSS assumes more importance than it represents, and also at the time of BJP's ticket distribution. The Congress is concerned because of the rebel factor - their vote bank tends to be somewhat more "swingy" than an ideological party's and the split factor would hurt them slightly more than BJP.

Sarbajit

On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 5:42 PM, Israel Jayakaran <israel@jayakaran.com> wrote:
Sarabajit.

      No, no, you are completely off the mark.  I am thinking of a political party where every face will be new but the most  intelligent and expereinced Indians  in some field  who are in a position to 'give' will be the members.

       We don't want theold haggards at all.  If one thinks that we cannot do without the old horses,he/she will be completely wrong. There are thousands of intellectuals and we have to pull them out.

       If we follow the strategy which I shall reveal in some appropriate time, I have no doubt that party will capture easily 500 seats and form a single party government.  And that' the need of the day as well.  The new adinistration will bring in new thoughts,new approaches and new work ethics..

       Don't forget that th voters are fed up with BJP and Congress. They are on the look out for a viable new party.  Bu where is it?  This where you and I come in.

       Are you with me so far?  Well, more later if you are on my wavelength.


        Regards,

                        Israel Jayakaran, Colonel (Retd), veteran, Chennai.



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--
      With regards to all,
      ------Mukund Apte

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