Wonder why most people are so narrow minded selfish and myopic that they want them and their pets to be taken care. Doesn't know how to view all as Human being and not as hindu muslim etc? Such people are trying to finish our country. These people who don't understand what great qualities mean are so mindless that they can talk of great people who had great qualities like Mahatma Gandhi, Nehru and others following such great teachings to serve the people instead of creating hatred and clashes for selfish interest. They don't even understand what is greatness and how difficult it is to do good in a country where several of people are like them. But thank God our country has a majority of people who can understand greatness to elect parties and leaders when they pursue the right path and know when to kick them out if they follow wrong path. Be it be any party, they can come to power and remain strong so long as they do not shelve the great ideologies they are required to follow. Let us not forget that even the greatest souls can slip since it is in the weak and sinful human body. Accepting such slips is further a great quality which makes a great leader. It is high time that people understand themselves before they criticize others especially the great elected leaders sacrificing their life for the country and the well being of it's people. Lapses can be their on any body's part. No one is God. But negative people see only lapses and not positive contributions. Such people are spreading venom with the fast communication tools available now. Instead Let us spread the message of love and brotherhood not hatred.
Balu
Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone
-----Original Message-----
From: Kumar Arun <kumar2786@hotmail.com>
Sender: indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net
Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 09:48:36
To: krishan tuli<kptuli@yahoo.com>; rajiv upadhyay<rajiv_upadhyay2003@yahoo.com>; IAC Sarabjit<indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>; Vaghela B.D(india)<vaghelabd@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Cc: Narain Kataria(NY)<katarian@aol.com>; Bhagwat Goel(India)<bhagwatgoel2000@yahoo.co.in>; Bhagvandass Tyagi(Scholar)<bhagavaandaas@yahoo.ca>; H.K Bhargava(ReformIndia)<hk.bhargava@yahoo.com>; Lalh Gehi(ReformIndia)<lalhgehi@yahoo.com>; Lal Bahadur Thapa (Nepal)<apasmalb@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?
Post: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net"
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Sunday, February 10, 2013
[IAC#RG] Request to Moderators to give Priority to New Topics
Dear Sir / Madam,
While the on-going discussion on some already posted messages on some topics can go on and those interested in it may read / respond, priority be given to the new topics initiated by anyone.
If the Members get fed up with so many topics & so many messages, they can better keep them in spam folder & read only the ones they feel like after glancing through the subject matter. The same can be deleted then. Alternately, they may opt out of the Group but putting too much restrictions on the no. of topics is certainly not advisable and not desirable also.
To me, corruption is inseparable from the most crucial aspect of governance & the group should not restrict topics only on corruption.
With warm regards,
--
(Babubhai Vaghela)
C 202, Shrinandnagar V, Makarba Road Vejalpur,
(Babubhai Vaghela)
C 202, Shrinandnagar V, Makarba Road Vejalpur,
Ahmedabad - 380051 M - 94276 08632
http://twitter.com/BabubhaiVaghela
About me at - http://bit.ly/9xsHFj
http://www.youtube.com/user/vaghelabd
http://t.co/7MMpHtIy
http://twitter.com/BabubhaiVaghela
About me at - http://bit.ly/9xsHFj
http://www.youtube.com/user/vaghelabd
http://t.co/7MMpHtIy
(Administrator - Google Group - Right to Information Act 2005)
[HumJanenge] Fwd: Fw: & Pass On
Bill.
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[IAC#RG] Not only discuss but need to tackle corruption - physical & moral.
Dear All,
Not everyone is corrupt.
Not everyone is clean and non-corrupt throughout.
But, the corruption does exist in everyday life.
There is Retail corruption.
There is Individual corruption.
There is Organisational corruption.
There is Bulk corruption.
There is Political corruption.
There is Bureaucratic corruption.
There is Judicial corruption.
There is Political - Bureaucratic - Judicial corruption.
There is Parliamentary corruption.
There is Journalistic corruption.
There is Corporate corruption.
There is Financial corruption.
There is non-Financial - Moral - Corruption.
However, the Govt Functionaries and the major beneficiaries of corruption, obviously, are least interested in exposing the wrong doing and corruption.
Media and vested interest as also Politicians, particularly in opposition, once in a while expose some corruption but rarely follow them up. Rather, they stop talking about it once their (undisclosed) personal demands are met.
That being the case, unless we, the apolitical concerned citizens, openly share our information and experiences on social media and find out ways & means to curb those undesired activities, only discussing something or simply grumbling serve no useful purpose at all.
In nutshell, in my opinion, our major emphasis should be action oriented aspects aiming at (1) pushing clean & competent persons in public life (2) stopping the corrupt & pliable persons from holding higher level offices and also curtailing their tenure in higher level offices (3) making hectic efforts, using varieties of means, to control the undesired activities of the persons in power.
This has to be a regular feature as the Elections after Elections have not improved governance and not curbed rampant naked corruption.
This requires simultaneous messages on umpteen no. of issues and everybody need not necessarily read / participate in every issue. (I myself, after looking at the subject matter, transfer to spam folder & delete those messages that I find of no interest / not action oriented.)
While concluding, I would say that there is a strong need to identify few specific areas of governance to tackle and work on them doggedly.
Otherwise, we shall continue to be like what crows do - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-6CB2PtSDU
Forever.............................................
Regards,
--
(Babubhai Vaghela)
C 202, Shrinandnagar V, Makarba Road Vejalpur,
Ahmedabad - 380051 M - 94276 08632
http://twitter.com/BabubhaiVaghela
About me at - http://bit.ly/9xsHFj
http://www.youtube.com/user/vaghelabd
http://t.co/7MMpHtIy
(Administrator - Google Group - Right to Information Act 2005)
Re: [IAC#RG] Why Moderator not approve the Messages?: "National Commissions, toothless bodies, need strengthening to be effective"
Dear Babubhai
Some of the reason why your emails are not posted to the list are as follows:-
(There may be other reasons by the other moderators)
1) This list receives between 200 and 300 emails each day. Of which we allow not more than 20. Even 20 is a huge strain on majority of our members who are fed up with receiving so many emails on daily basis.
2) You yourself post between 10-20 messages each day to the list on diverse subjects - many of them unconnected to corruption. Most of these emails link to old posts on your RTI googlegroup. For instance your attached post which was rejected links back to a ToI news story of 2008 vintage.
3) As IAC does not want to curtail freedom of speech to anyone on this list, we have set up the Indiaresists forum. Membership is moderated and needs approval, once you are approved please feel free to say/post whatever you want (within reason, ToC of the webhost, and without abuse, libel, defamation, etc) as the forum is unmoderated.
Here is the link for anyone on this list who wishes to register.
http://indiaresists.org/forum/
4) Based on your post, IAC (of which you are the seniormost and valued member/contributor) shall be announcing more measures to better channel the number and content of the emails posted to this list by our patriotic members.
Sarbajit
Some of the reason why your emails are not posted to the list are as follows:-
(There may be other reasons by the other moderators)
1) This list receives between 200 and 300 emails each day. Of which we allow not more than 20. Even 20 is a huge strain on majority of our members who are fed up with receiving so many emails on daily basis.
2) You yourself post between 10-20 messages each day to the list on diverse subjects - many of them unconnected to corruption. Most of these emails link to old posts on your RTI googlegroup. For instance your attached post which was rejected links back to a ToI news story of 2008 vintage.
3) As IAC does not want to curtail freedom of speech to anyone on this list, we have set up the Indiaresists forum. Membership is moderated and needs approval, once you are approved please feel free to say/post whatever you want (within reason, ToC of the webhost, and without abuse, libel, defamation, etc) as the forum is unmoderated.
Here is the link for anyone on this list who wishes to register.
http://indiaresists.org/forum/
4) Based on your post, IAC (of which you are the seniormost and valued member/contributor) shall be announcing more measures to better channel the number and content of the emails posted to this list by our patriotic members.
Sarbajit
On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 3:44 PM, Babubhai Vaghela <vaghelabd@yahoo.com> wrote:
Dear All,I just wonder as to why the Moderator not approve the Message that I post.There is nothing against any individual in the message.There is nothing derogatory also.It is an analysis and observations on strengthening the governance system.Incidentally, this is not the only message that has remained in queue for so long.And, I am not the only one whose messages remain uncleared by the Moderator.With warm regards,Babubhai Vaghela,AhmedabadM - 9427608632---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Babubhai Vaghela <vaghelabd@yahoo.com>
Date: Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 11:39 AM
Subject: "National Commissions, toothless bodies, need strengthening to be effective"
To: indiaresists <indiaresists@lists.riseup.net>
Dear All,"All the National Commissions, toothless bodies, are White Tigers and need strengthening to be effective to deliver goods".The reason why I say so - https://t.co/57KOXjJeWith warm regards,--
(Babubhai Vaghela)
Re: [IAC#RG] Setup new Nation???
Dear Arunji
Perhaps you have misunderstood me.
1) IAC is not mine, nor do we "control" the mailing list. Everyone is welcome to use IAC's facilities as long as they conform to our norms. However, we received between 200 to 300 emails each day so we cannot guarantee that your email will be sent to our members.
2) We are an APOLITICAL movement, so calls to support Mr. Narendra Modi to counter Sonia Gandhi (or vice-versa) is not permitted on our list.
3) You are welcome to believe that Anna and Arvind Kejriwal are patriots. As far as IAC is concerned they are no longer active participants in our process.
Sarbajit
Perhaps you have misunderstood me.
1) IAC is not mine, nor do we "control" the mailing list. Everyone is welcome to use IAC's facilities as long as they conform to our norms. However, we received between 200 to 300 emails each day so we cannot guarantee that your email will be sent to our members.
2) We are an APOLITICAL movement, so calls to support Mr. Narendra Modi to counter Sonia Gandhi (or vice-versa) is not permitted on our list.
3) You are welcome to believe that Anna and Arvind Kejriwal are patriots. As far as IAC is concerned they are no longer active participants in our process.
Sarbajit
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 5:42 PM, Kumar Arun <kumar2786@hotmail.com> wrote:
Dear Sarabjitji,
I would like very much not to be controversial figure in your mind. As you have
mentioned, IAC is yours and you have full right to control the traffic of e-mails.
If you look carefully, I merely replied to all and I am sure your IAC mailing address
was included in this process. Following addresses were already in circulation:
Promod Chawla (promod.chawla@gmail.com); IAC Sarabjit (indiaresists@lists.riseup.net); krishan tuli (kptuli@yahoo.com); rajiv upadhyay (rajiv_upadhyay2003@yahoo.com); Umesh Rohatgi (rurohatgi@gmail.com);
Few more names I had included into the list which is completely a different matter.
As far as your views towards some of the patriots of India, that do not appeal to me.
However, you have complete freedom to express your opinion about them and so do I.
I will pay more attention to my outgoing mail and avoid using your & IAC mailing address
in my future communications.
Warm regards,
Dr. Kumar Arun
Re: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?
Who is Hindu in this country, either every one is Hindu or no one is Hindu. Hindu is no religion it is a way of living. Every body living east of Indus river was named as Hindu by first Alexander the grate n than by Muslin n Mogul invaders. secondly no sensible person should fight on religion it is nothing but a man made social system for better living as per prevailling condirions of that area wher the religion was created n no religion is above humanity since it is all created by human beings on the name of invisible God, it seems that the word God itself has been created by the humans to create certain order or fear in the human society. All the religion have certain basic similarities like, non violnce, freedom from greed, desire, anger,attechment, ego,jealosy n fear etc. But how many of understand n act on this instead we all r full of these weaknesses. We so called Hidus r no non violent when it comes to its need, look to our History pre Mogal
periods n pre British period, we have been fighting with each other like dogs. We surrendered only to our superior forces tamed n accepted salevery because of our weakness. Todays religion is only a politics of different groups of political parties n religions to misguide n controll the common man. Finally let us forget our religion n cast n become citizen of India first.
________________________________
From: M.N.Seshadri <manavasi.seshadri@gmail.com>
To: indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Sent: Saturday, 9 February 2013 8:56 PM
Subject: RE: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?
----- Forwarded Message -----
This message is eligible for Automatic Cleanup! (manavasi.seshadri@gmail.com) Add cleanup rule | More info
It is because of the tolerance and the philosophy ( Vedanta and Upanishad ) Christians who were all converted are flourishing .It is a well known fact that before the emergence of HINDU organizations like VHP, HINDU MUNNANI, and so on the Hindus never took any serious objections to conversions by Christian Missionaries and the Muslim organizations . Hindus believe in the fact that there is just one GOD and never bothered to interfere with these activities of other religions .
But recently the POLITICIANS have created this hatred because of VOTE BANK POLITICS . Religion is a matter of personal choice and if every body is treated alike there cannot be any big problem . God has no politics !!
Mr. Koshy can stay in India . He will be well looked after. !!
From:indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net [mailto:indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net] On Behalf Of marshwiggle23
Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2013 3:16 PM
To: indiaresists
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?
if all non hindus leave or are forced to leave india will india become a heaven?
Koshy
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 3:14 PM, marshwiggle23 <terrestrian@gmail.com> wrote:
i am a christian should i be expelled?
Koshy
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 2:06 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Ravi
>
>Thanks for sharing your views.
>
>As an ardent patriot and nationalist myself, let me supplement your knowledge of "sainik sangh" which I could glean from their website "http://www.sainiksangh.org%22/;.
>
>1) The Organisation is the "Ex-Serviceman's League" raised on 1997 and is a Registered body/society. It is an apolitical, non-profit body working for IESM's which does not raise funds and works to instill patriotism and discipline primarily in rural IESM's and is focussed on Spartan ethics and women's empowerment. It is headed up by Lt.Genl (Retd) G.S.Grewal - Armoured Corps and Maj Gen(Retd) APS Chauhan - Corps of Engineers. Hence to my limited mind the organisation seems to be one which mirrors IAC's own systems, approach and values .. such as anti-tobacco, anti-alcohol etc.. What say you?
>
>2) I personally find the points made by Lt. Gen GS Grewal to be very apt and definitely NOT "trash". We should really introspect if we are all just another bunch of lazy soft arm-chair Internet "warriors". I know that I am certainly not such a one - what about you?
>
>3) I fully reciprocate your concluding sentiments that we shed the dead weights to have the India of our dreams to live in and enjoy.
>
>4) Your points about Nehru, Gandhi, and Sardar Patel are quite hackneyed by now. In the age of Sonia-raj such arguments serve no purpose and only distract us from our objectives.
>
>5) The statement in favour of 1 billion Hindus is specious. This has been arrived at in a dishonest way by legislating that everyone who is NOT a Christian, Muslim, Jew or Parsi is automatically a Hindu. Gen Grewal is correct, there is no such animal as a Hindu - Hindus are only artefacts of the British raj. By this dubious definition was Lord Raavan any less of a Hindu than Lord Ram? Babubahi's query is really to be paraphrased as - should we not expel all Muslims, Christians, Jews and Parsis etc. from India.
>
>PS: Mark Tully and Rafiq Zakaria to buttress one's arguments ???
>
>Sarbajit
>
>On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 5:58 AM, Ravindran P M <raviforjustice@gmail.com> wrote:
>Sainik Sangh is no person but definitely a person is the author of this trash. Of course the present idea of India may not have existed during pre-british times but the culture, the shared bond had always been there from practically time immemorial. Differences were there too. Isn't each individual different from one another? But does that take away our common identity as a human being? Definitely not.
>
>Here are a few quotes relevant for consideration:
>
>"The genius of Hinduism, the very reason it has survived so long, is that it does not stand up and fight. It changes and adapts and modernises and absorbs–that is the scientific and proper way of going about it. I believe that Hinduism may actually prove to be the religion of this millennium, because it can adapt itself to change".-Mark Tully
>
>"Finally, I am sometimes flabbergasted at the fact that Indians –Hindus, sorry, as most of this country's intelligentsia is Hindu – seem to love me so much, considering the fact that in my heydays, I considerably ran down the 850 million Hindus of this country, one billion worldwide. I have repented today: I do profoundly believe that India needs to be able to say with pride, "Yes, our civilisation has a Hindu base to it."-Mark Tully
>
>" Had it not been for the Secular temper of a large number of Hindus and the broad Humanitarianism which is the kernel of Hinduism, the extermination of Indian Muslims would have been easily carried out"- Rafiq Zakharia.
>
>Coming to Nehru, let me harp that he is the 1st communalist of free India. It was his hunger for power and pelf that he covered by his communal statement that the Hindus will not like Jinnah being made the 1st PM of undivided India! It was he who blackmailed Gandhiji to prevail on Sardar Patel who would have become the 1st PM democratically. It was he who refused to accept Gandhij's suggestion of disbanding congress after independence so that its fair name was not misused by individuals. Worse, he had most deceitfully gone on to misuse even the surname of the Father of the Nation! The list can go on but suffice to say that the foundations of the current problem ridden state was laid by Nehru and Nehru alone. We all know when the foundation is weak the super structure can never be stable or reliable.
>
>Yes, your question, what have people who have come after Nehru done to correct course, is relevant. Yes, it is those rumblings of change you are hearing now. After all we are yet to get over the trappings of devil worship.
>
>Another issue that I find mentioned and deserves a reply is that of the bulk of hindus being menial servants etc. I think it is such a silly observation that really does not deserve a reply except that it leads to some more related issues. Take any establishment and show me any one of them which is top heavy. How many General Managers do the Ambanis have in their factories and how many menial workers? The caste system! Is caste system the only difference that is material and objectionable? Just because we have a name for such a difference also everybody harps on it and uses it as a stick to beat every hindu with. How many sects and subsects are there in xtainity? In islam? Is every xtian/muslim well off, even in their countries of origin? And now, in less than 70 years of so called independence and democracy where are we with respect to these 'evils' like caste , untouchability etc? Isn't it true that we have graduated from untouchability to
unsightabilty? And haven't we replaced the earlier caste system with a new one- the nehru family, the others in government, the corporate mercenaries and the rest?
>
>And sorry, the britishers have not left their estate for safe keeping. Whether it was Gandhiji's non-violent movement or the not so peaceful tactics of Bhagat Singh, Subhash Chandra Bose etc, the fact is that they were forced to leave. Again, unfortunately for us, the person who took over the reins of power happened to be the worst choice for a newly liberated nation raring to go. Anyhow we are shedding the dead weights and hope sooner than later we will have the India of our dreams to live in and enjoy.
>
>regards n bw
>
>ravi
>On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 6:49 PM, Sainik Sangh <gs@sainiksangh.org> wrote:
>WHAT PIPE DREAMING BY EITHER PAID AGENTS OUT FOR MISCHIEF OR SIMPLY DUMB INTELLECTUALS OR UNOCCUPIED KEYBOARD LOVERS AND HAVE NO CONSTRUCTIVE MIND OR JUST DAY DREAMERS
>>FIRST WHEN WAS THERE EVER A 'HINDU ' NATION IN HUMAN HISTORY? THERE WAS A MAURYAN EMPIRE , MARATHA NATION , RAJPUT KINGDOMS BUT YET NO NATION, THE MOGHUL EMPIRE AND NO MORE OF COURSE THE CHRISTIAN BRITISH EMPIRE . THE BULK OF WHAT ARE CALLED HINDUS WERE JUST MENIAL SERVANTS , UNTOUCHABLES , PETTY TRADERS , WORKERS, FARMERS , BOOK KEEPERS , JEWELERS , REST LOOTERS MARAUDERS ETC AND TEMPLE PRIESTS . NOW HAVING BEEN CHRISTENED INTO WESTERN STYLE DEMOCRACY WHAT GREAT ENGINE OF POWER AND WISDOM HAVE HINDUS BECOME? WHEN TWO HINDUS ARE NOT SIMILAR , NOR LOOK ALIKE , NOR SPEAK THE SAME LANGUAGE NOR TRUST EACH OTHER, NOR HAVE ANY STAMP OF THEIR OWN- HAVE NO LANGUAGE THE MAIN DISTINCTION OF A NATION –NO LEADER ( DON'T SAY THAT TILAKDHARI MODI OR TAGODIA ARE LEADERS) NO FLAG ! SO I DO NOT KNOW TO WHAT SPECIS OF HUMANS YOU ARE REFERING TO? THE ONLY THOUGHT ONE COULD HAVE OF THIS NATURE WAS IN THE MONARCHY OF NEPAL THAT WAS A HINDU
NATION THE LAST ONE .
>>NEXT YOU CANNOT RUN THIS NATION WHICH IS 80% HINDUS HOW CAN YLOU RUN A 100% ONE?
>>ANDS WHO MADE ALL THE MESS YOU ARE SO FED UP WITH IF NOGT ONLY HINDUS ? WASN'T GANDHI A HINDU, NEHRU TOO, SHASHTRI TOO, ATAL BIHARI TOO ETC ETC .
>>WHY DO YOU KEEP BLAMING NEHRU HE IS DEAD WHAT DID YOU DO AFTER HIM?
>>AND WHAT IS THIS GIMMICK INDIA RESISTS RESISTS WHAT ?
>> A PEOPLE USED TO BEING SLAVES WILL REMAIN SO HOWEVER COSMETIC CHANGES THEY MAY ACQUIRE UNLESS THEY OVERTHROW THEIR MASTER . THE TRUTH IS IF THE MASTER HANDS OVER THE KEYS OF HIS ESTATE FOR SAFE KEEPING AND HE MAKES A RETREAT THAT DLOESNT CHANGE THE SLAVE ! THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WE ARE SUFFERING FROM WHICH MAKES HINDUS A SUBMISSIVE AND EVASSIVE CONGREGATION WITH LITTLE MAKINGS OF A NATION!
>>A NATIONALIST
>>
>>
>
>
>Post: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net"
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>Quit: "https://lists.riseup.net/www/signoff/indiaresists%22;
>Help: https://help.riseup.net/en/list-user
>WWW : http://indiaagainstcorruption.net.in/
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periods n pre British period, we have been fighting with each other like dogs. We surrendered only to our superior forces tamed n accepted salevery because of our weakness. Todays religion is only a politics of different groups of political parties n religions to misguide n controll the common man. Finally let us forget our religion n cast n become citizen of India first.
________________________________
From: M.N.Seshadri <manavasi.seshadri@gmail.com>
To: indiaresists@lists.riseup.net
Sent: Saturday, 9 February 2013 8:56 PM
Subject: RE: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?
----- Forwarded Message -----
This message is eligible for Automatic Cleanup! (manavasi.seshadri@gmail.com) Add cleanup rule | More info
It is because of the tolerance and the philosophy ( Vedanta and Upanishad ) Christians who were all converted are flourishing .It is a well known fact that before the emergence of HINDU organizations like VHP, HINDU MUNNANI, and so on the Hindus never took any serious objections to conversions by Christian Missionaries and the Muslim organizations . Hindus believe in the fact that there is just one GOD and never bothered to interfere with these activities of other religions .
But recently the POLITICIANS have created this hatred because of VOTE BANK POLITICS . Religion is a matter of personal choice and if every body is treated alike there cannot be any big problem . God has no politics !!
Mr. Koshy can stay in India . He will be well looked after. !!
From:indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net [mailto:indiaresists-request@lists.riseup.net] On Behalf Of marshwiggle23
Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2013 3:16 PM
To: indiaresists
Subject: Re: [IAC#RG] Why Hindus not setup new Nation?
if all non hindus leave or are forced to leave india will india become a heaven?
Koshy
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 3:14 PM, marshwiggle23 <terrestrian@gmail.com> wrote:
i am a christian should i be expelled?
Koshy
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 2:06 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Ravi
>
>Thanks for sharing your views.
>
>As an ardent patriot and nationalist myself, let me supplement your knowledge of "sainik sangh" which I could glean from their website "http://www.sainiksangh.org%22/;.
>
>1) The Organisation is the "Ex-Serviceman's League" raised on 1997 and is a Registered body/society. It is an apolitical, non-profit body working for IESM's which does not raise funds and works to instill patriotism and discipline primarily in rural IESM's and is focussed on Spartan ethics and women's empowerment. It is headed up by Lt.Genl (Retd) G.S.Grewal - Armoured Corps and Maj Gen(Retd) APS Chauhan - Corps of Engineers. Hence to my limited mind the organisation seems to be one which mirrors IAC's own systems, approach and values .. such as anti-tobacco, anti-alcohol etc.. What say you?
>
>2) I personally find the points made by Lt. Gen GS Grewal to be very apt and definitely NOT "trash". We should really introspect if we are all just another bunch of lazy soft arm-chair Internet "warriors". I know that I am certainly not such a one - what about you?
>
>3) I fully reciprocate your concluding sentiments that we shed the dead weights to have the India of our dreams to live in and enjoy.
>
>4) Your points about Nehru, Gandhi, and Sardar Patel are quite hackneyed by now. In the age of Sonia-raj such arguments serve no purpose and only distract us from our objectives.
>
>5) The statement in favour of 1 billion Hindus is specious. This has been arrived at in a dishonest way by legislating that everyone who is NOT a Christian, Muslim, Jew or Parsi is automatically a Hindu. Gen Grewal is correct, there is no such animal as a Hindu - Hindus are only artefacts of the British raj. By this dubious definition was Lord Raavan any less of a Hindu than Lord Ram? Babubahi's query is really to be paraphrased as - should we not expel all Muslims, Christians, Jews and Parsis etc. from India.
>
>PS: Mark Tully and Rafiq Zakaria to buttress one's arguments ???
>
>Sarbajit
>
>On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 5:58 AM, Ravindran P M <raviforjustice@gmail.com> wrote:
>Sainik Sangh is no person but definitely a person is the author of this trash. Of course the present idea of India may not have existed during pre-british times but the culture, the shared bond had always been there from practically time immemorial. Differences were there too. Isn't each individual different from one another? But does that take away our common identity as a human being? Definitely not.
>
>Here are a few quotes relevant for consideration:
>
>"The genius of Hinduism, the very reason it has survived so long, is that it does not stand up and fight. It changes and adapts and modernises and absorbs–that is the scientific and proper way of going about it. I believe that Hinduism may actually prove to be the religion of this millennium, because it can adapt itself to change".-Mark Tully
>
>"Finally, I am sometimes flabbergasted at the fact that Indians –Hindus, sorry, as most of this country's intelligentsia is Hindu – seem to love me so much, considering the fact that in my heydays, I considerably ran down the 850 million Hindus of this country, one billion worldwide. I have repented today: I do profoundly believe that India needs to be able to say with pride, "Yes, our civilisation has a Hindu base to it."-Mark Tully
>
>" Had it not been for the Secular temper of a large number of Hindus and the broad Humanitarianism which is the kernel of Hinduism, the extermination of Indian Muslims would have been easily carried out"- Rafiq Zakharia.
>
>Coming to Nehru, let me harp that he is the 1st communalist of free India. It was his hunger for power and pelf that he covered by his communal statement that the Hindus will not like Jinnah being made the 1st PM of undivided India! It was he who blackmailed Gandhiji to prevail on Sardar Patel who would have become the 1st PM democratically. It was he who refused to accept Gandhij's suggestion of disbanding congress after independence so that its fair name was not misused by individuals. Worse, he had most deceitfully gone on to misuse even the surname of the Father of the Nation! The list can go on but suffice to say that the foundations of the current problem ridden state was laid by Nehru and Nehru alone. We all know when the foundation is weak the super structure can never be stable or reliable.
>
>Yes, your question, what have people who have come after Nehru done to correct course, is relevant. Yes, it is those rumblings of change you are hearing now. After all we are yet to get over the trappings of devil worship.
>
>Another issue that I find mentioned and deserves a reply is that of the bulk of hindus being menial servants etc. I think it is such a silly observation that really does not deserve a reply except that it leads to some more related issues. Take any establishment and show me any one of them which is top heavy. How many General Managers do the Ambanis have in their factories and how many menial workers? The caste system! Is caste system the only difference that is material and objectionable? Just because we have a name for such a difference also everybody harps on it and uses it as a stick to beat every hindu with. How many sects and subsects are there in xtainity? In islam? Is every xtian/muslim well off, even in their countries of origin? And now, in less than 70 years of so called independence and democracy where are we with respect to these 'evils' like caste , untouchability etc? Isn't it true that we have graduated from untouchability to
unsightabilty? And haven't we replaced the earlier caste system with a new one- the nehru family, the others in government, the corporate mercenaries and the rest?
>
>And sorry, the britishers have not left their estate for safe keeping. Whether it was Gandhiji's non-violent movement or the not so peaceful tactics of Bhagat Singh, Subhash Chandra Bose etc, the fact is that they were forced to leave. Again, unfortunately for us, the person who took over the reins of power happened to be the worst choice for a newly liberated nation raring to go. Anyhow we are shedding the dead weights and hope sooner than later we will have the India of our dreams to live in and enjoy.
>
>regards n bw
>
>ravi
>On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 6:49 PM, Sainik Sangh <gs@sainiksangh.org> wrote:
>WHAT PIPE DREAMING BY EITHER PAID AGENTS OUT FOR MISCHIEF OR SIMPLY DUMB INTELLECTUALS OR UNOCCUPIED KEYBOARD LOVERS AND HAVE NO CONSTRUCTIVE MIND OR JUST DAY DREAMERS
>>FIRST WHEN WAS THERE EVER A 'HINDU ' NATION IN HUMAN HISTORY? THERE WAS A MAURYAN EMPIRE , MARATHA NATION , RAJPUT KINGDOMS BUT YET NO NATION, THE MOGHUL EMPIRE AND NO MORE OF COURSE THE CHRISTIAN BRITISH EMPIRE . THE BULK OF WHAT ARE CALLED HINDUS WERE JUST MENIAL SERVANTS , UNTOUCHABLES , PETTY TRADERS , WORKERS, FARMERS , BOOK KEEPERS , JEWELERS , REST LOOTERS MARAUDERS ETC AND TEMPLE PRIESTS . NOW HAVING BEEN CHRISTENED INTO WESTERN STYLE DEMOCRACY WHAT GREAT ENGINE OF POWER AND WISDOM HAVE HINDUS BECOME? WHEN TWO HINDUS ARE NOT SIMILAR , NOR LOOK ALIKE , NOR SPEAK THE SAME LANGUAGE NOR TRUST EACH OTHER, NOR HAVE ANY STAMP OF THEIR OWN- HAVE NO LANGUAGE THE MAIN DISTINCTION OF A NATION –NO LEADER ( DON'T SAY THAT TILAKDHARI MODI OR TAGODIA ARE LEADERS) NO FLAG ! SO I DO NOT KNOW TO WHAT SPECIS OF HUMANS YOU ARE REFERING TO? THE ONLY THOUGHT ONE COULD HAVE OF THIS NATURE WAS IN THE MONARCHY OF NEPAL THAT WAS A HINDU
NATION THE LAST ONE .
>>NEXT YOU CANNOT RUN THIS NATION WHICH IS 80% HINDUS HOW CAN YLOU RUN A 100% ONE?
>>ANDS WHO MADE ALL THE MESS YOU ARE SO FED UP WITH IF NOGT ONLY HINDUS ? WASN'T GANDHI A HINDU, NEHRU TOO, SHASHTRI TOO, ATAL BIHARI TOO ETC ETC .
>>WHY DO YOU KEEP BLAMING NEHRU HE IS DEAD WHAT DID YOU DO AFTER HIM?
>>AND WHAT IS THIS GIMMICK INDIA RESISTS RESISTS WHAT ?
>> A PEOPLE USED TO BEING SLAVES WILL REMAIN SO HOWEVER COSMETIC CHANGES THEY MAY ACQUIRE UNLESS THEY OVERTHROW THEIR MASTER . THE TRUTH IS IF THE MASTER HANDS OVER THE KEYS OF HIS ESTATE FOR SAFE KEEPING AND HE MAKES A RETREAT THAT DLOESNT CHANGE THE SLAVE ! THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WE ARE SUFFERING FROM WHICH MAKES HINDUS A SUBMISSIVE AND EVASSIVE CONGREGATION WITH LITTLE MAKINGS OF A NATION!
>>A NATIONALIST
>>
>>
>
>
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